oldvet said: Only God can save this once great country now.
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That is SO funny....who was going to save YOU? Donald Trump? Rush? Watch this so you can point your finger at the guilty party...
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpVg3TwZP...

BTW ... to address the ill-framed 47% statement that helped Romney lose the election. That is 47% of the American taxpayers that do not pay federal income tax. Some of those are rich people using loopholes to avoid taxes. Some of those are people hurting that need and deserve a hand-up. Some of those are people that are just looking for a hand-out. I have no problem with helping the 2nd group needing a hand-up. Using tax money to provide childcare for some of these people so they can afford to get into the workforce and improve skills is an example.
My Father was a lifelong farmer but also a Social Worker for 20 years to keep us from losing the family farm. He took me with him several times during the summer of my junor year of high school as he visited clients to observe. I got a first hand look at both people looking for a hand-up and those for a hand-out. 2 paralyzed young men used the help to get college degrees, become teachers, and self sufficient. Others drank up the check before it ever got home to the wife and children. Has had a life long impact on my thinking.

Maybe the Democrats and Republicans lawmakers need to take a look at their individual "principles" and "idealogy" and realize they do not fit those of the country. The country is not hard right or hard left but only has those choices each fall. Look at the dismal approval rating of Congress. I think we want what most people in the world want ... safety, health, job opportunity, a better world for our children, a chance to live our lifes without major government interference. (I exclude the religious fanatics that believe in killing any that disagree including their own children as suicide bombers". So why do we let the politicians continue to push us to either extreme. We want jobs, we want a future for our children not overshadowed by debt. Why can not both parties as well as the bloggers on this page see that? IMO

Thanks for the response kai it looks like you and I are more in agrement than not. I look at actions not what is said in politics and seeing both parties spend us into oblivion is not anything I can support. The part that frustrates me mor ethan anything is the partisan support of both parties and the finger pointing that is at times childish and irrational considering the similarities in actions between the parties. Again I have little hope of any positive change for the long term.

I hope for a budget that works for America. When your "outs" are more than your "ins", logically you are going backwards. Politics aside, we need Washington to work together and figure out the math. Example : Social Security. We are told that it will run out of money very soon. So what do we do? Have employees pay in 2% LESS to a system that is already struggling and cash-poor. How does that make any sense in the long run?

Only God can save this once great country now.

poorrichard,
As always, it has been a pleasure talking with you. Sleep well.

Eagle1,
Sorry for the late response. I have been away from a computer for a while, and searching from my phone is tedious and time consuming.

I thought for certain I had heard from several sources that in general, the United States (for the past 100 years or so) has been becoming more and more conservative. This is because the Right wing becomes very extreme. That has a kind of "gravitational" effect on the left, pulling liberals closer to the center. I did not want to make this comment without finding some evidence to back up my claim, though.

It took finding the correct search terms to get a result. First, I pulled up a bunch of recent articles. Many were supportive of my premise, but seemed to be based more on opinion than on fact. I found some results that mentioned global warming (0.o I am not sure how that was figured in, I didn't use any word that could be associated with global warming besides "trend" in my searches.)

I finally found the correct combination of terms: "political trend united states" is what I typed into Google. The first result on the first page provides the comprehensive information I was looking for all along. ( http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/201... )

The data set does not 100% confirm what I had thought. To restate myself, I thought the right wing had gone so far right, the left had been dragged to the center. In actuality, this data shows that the right has gone more right, and the left has gone more left. More accurately, the data takes a look at the divide (gap), rather than just how liberal or conservative we are. The website does note, however, that the gap is quite large mostly because conservatives have become very conservative over the years. In other words, while liberals have become more liberal, their contribution to the divide is minimal when compared to the contribution of conservatives.

As far as spending and increasing the size of government goes, this has been a problem since post WWII. In other words, the Cold War greased these gears the most. After WWII, Democrats wanted to expand social welfare programs to be even more comprehensive. Every opportunity they had, they spent more on social welfare. Republicans wanted to inject as much money into defense as they could. Every opportunity they had, they spent more on the defense budget. Democrats would try to raise taxes to create revenue, and Republicans would cut taxes to promote a free market. What should have been done all along, though, was a combination of raising taxes, closing loop holes, and a decision on what we wanted to spend money on.

The problem is such a difficult one for our politicians to tackle, though, that we are still fighting over it today.

The Bush era Republicans were not the first Republicans to spend without reservation.

”If Barack Obama becomes the president in November, again,
I will be either be dead or in jail by this time next year.”
Ted Nugent, April 17, 2012.
I hope that Terrible Ted will take some advice from the late Frank Zappa -
"Shut Up 'n Play Yer Guitar".

thekai-You're in some kind of dream world and thats where I'm heading to. Good night and God bless.

poorrichard,
It was the Republicans who refused to compromise and tried to rush a piece of legislation through that caused the Democrats to try to do -something- to slow things down. Then, it was the Republicans who still refused to compromise, thereby making the Democratic senators feel they had to stay away. Maybe you have forgotten the timeline of how everything happened, but I have not.

Go to YouTube to see the hatred. I'm not a big country fan, but every now and then I like to listen. Check out Toby Keith's "I Love this Bar" to see some of the hatred. Go to any country song and look through the comments. Go to cnn and look at the comments some on the right make (and yes, some on the left too). There are countless examples on the internet of hatred, from both sides. However, I have personally observed far more hatred from the conservative right than from the liberal left.

According to many Republicans, Democrats are just cry baby racists who voted for Obama because of his skin color.

Ironically, some of the evidence that Democrats compromise is Obamacare. It is only a shell of what it was supposed to be specifically because Democrats compromised with Republicans.

thekai- Who left the state rather than compromise?
Which party switched over to shoot down the mining bill?
Show me this evidence you have that the Democrats are so compromising.
Where are you looking so careful, as you say,to find this hate in the Tea Party? You want to see real hate, look at some of the tweets to Fox News.

I hope the reflublicans send even MORE money to carl rove. fail

The rich only care about the "Bush's tax breaks for the rich". It's obvious the tax breaks didn't work for the past 10 years they had them and it is time to get rid of them. It is time the free ride for the rich ends.

What I like to see happen is they come out with a true no call list. I am so sick of these robo calls.

thekai as someone that cannot lower myself to support either party because they are too much alike I think you may want to look at the deterioration of the GOP over the past 12 years primarily during the Bush years and their willingness to adopt Democrat positions on key issues. In general terms... spending and increasing govt. There is a large number of us that are not served by either party because the GOP has definitely moved towards the Democrats moreso than the opposite, thus the GOP suffers less support than the Dems in the presidential cycles, 3 million less people voted for Mitt than McCain, just more casualties as the two parties become one in taking over more of America.

Except Obama..the most liberal of all presidents is unwilling to compromise...if he had, Obumacare would never have passed.

poorrichard,

The problem with using someone else's post as a template, and changing a few subjects, is most people cannot do it effectively. For example, you wish to portray Democrats as uncompromising. However, there is plenty of evidence that shows to the contrary.

In particular, I would point to the difference in fundamentals and nature of the two parties. Republicans believe that compromising is a sign of weakness and inability to lead. Democrats view compromise as a sign of diversity and a source of strength.

Anyone can disagree with my theory as much as they want. It is only a theory of mine. I disagree with you about how much sense it makes. I think it is very evident, especially after this last election cycle, that there are many wealthy republican business owners and corporate entities who supported groups who CLEARLY had a number one goal of making Obama fail. I do not think it is out of the question that at least some of those entities did what they could to help Obama look weak on the economy.

I think if you look carefully, you will find much more hate out of Republicans, specifically the TEA Party, than the Democrats.

Wow egalindo, that is disheartening. I hope you really are out of the teaching business.

How about getting back to Republic our Forefathers put forth for us? The power of the federal government is stripping away our individual rights. With people like egalindo actually admitting their socialist wishes I am even more discouraged that we can turn this around. That and 16 trilllion other reasons.

usaret, yes people like NVgrf on both sides are absolutely the problem.

Greg, I have no hope at all now, just profound sadness for our country.

as far as the federal election results go, I am mostly happy, with exception to Ryan winning the congressional seat...as far as the local elections go, I am dismayed with the republican control of our state. This is not a conservative experimental state, it is progressive Wisconsin....go Badgers!

HOPEless!
Four more years of economic carnage.

thekai-We are still clearly a house divided. Why are so many Democrats afraid of compromise?
The goal of Democrats was to ensure that Obama be a 2 term president has succeeded. I hope this means Democrats will focus on strengthening this great nation, instead of trying to weaken it. I hope this means our recovery will finally get going.
As far as your theory-If thats what you think, thats fine and dandy but makes no sense.
"All of this, this slow recovery, in the name of greed. In the name of hatred. I suspect the recovery will finally start."
I think you will find most if not all of the hatred is from your side. And if it was greed we would of had the recovery 3 years ago.

I am concerned about the unintended consequences that will show up during the next 2 years of the ACHA. Less money paid to Medicare providers likely will mean more will stop accepting Medicare. Thereby creating a shortage and additional waits. Forcing employees to pay for additional benefits based on their number of full time employees may create more part time jobs. JVLhomeowner: I can understand how insurance is out of the question for you ... What happens in 2014 when you get some assistance from the government (other taxpayers money) but not enough to buy insurance? Unless you meet an exemption, you will be penalized for not having health care. An issue that many of the working poor will have. I hope in the next 2 years they work at keeping the good aspects of the ACHA in place but improving on the "gotcha stuff that is going to conveniently not hit until after the 2014 mid-term elections. I think people deserve a hand-up, not a handout and that there ae lots of people deserving of that hand-up. I do not think the ACHA adequately addressed the issue of making sure everyone has access to AFFORDABLE healthcare. But they have to figure out how to pay for it. Lots of promises made by both sides during the campaign but very fuzzy math by both on how they were going to pay for it. Projected savings from ending wars and from eliminating waste did not cut it for me. You never know what the world will bring for military needs in the future. And both parties are good at identifying possible waste and abuse but neither do much about it. imo

My hope were dashed when I started reading the comments here. I was hoping thatwe could finally all get to business and straighten out this country, but I see by the "regulars" comments that it will be trash talk as usual... all that is missing is Wislady's links to an obscure website spewing nonsense...
Yes sigma QUIT your job then try and get some benefits....
mrsdamracefan..you pay $140 a week for insurance...I bring home about $200 after taxes, Insurance is out of the question.

Just when I thought now that the election is over we won't have to discuss it. I find myself reading another article about "politics". On my fb the biggest "hater" was a democrat. You couldn't even discuss it or they wanted me to defriend them. Now that it is over they posted "lets stop the hate"! Have to feel sorry for them, because they were the one that wouldn't even work with you as a friend. I guess that is what it is all about in Washington.

NVgrf: You always seem to blame the Republicans for everything as tho only the Democrat's have the answers. Republicans need to give in. Why not the Democrats? Guess you idea of compromise is my way or else. Based on your many partison comments, don't you think you are part of the problem?

Hoping that Obama has learned something and will start to lead ALL the country, beginning with doing a budget. Time for his rhetoric to become reality, and actually work with both parties.

He will continue creeping new world-order into our Constitutional rights. I have no "hope" right now. People voted based on spoon fed tripe and emotion again, instead of mindful responsibility. They deserve what ever negative aspects that result from this election.

The two party system has been the root of this country’s problems for the last century. That being said I find it laughable when posters claim one side needs to cave on principles when these have nothing to do with the problems at hand.

Our country is facing a fiscal problem. This problem has only grown over the past 60 years, since the last entitlement program was started; medicare. The idea that spending more money or taking more from tax payers will solve anything has proven FALSE for the last 6 decades. The last time our nation reduced the national debt was 1957, and for the following 24 years the highest income tax brackets were 70% or above.

The solutions are simple; the politics are the hard part. This has nothing to do with caving on issues or principles; it has to do with what is needed to keep our country from becoming the next Greece. Stop wasting money!

As one commentator stated last night ... Obama has more flexibility to deal with the Republicans than he had when running for election since it is a two term limit. Hopefully he uses the flexibility there instead of when dealing with Putin. That said, not all Republicans were obstructionists. Mitch McConnell started the loss on Tuesday years ago with his stupid statement. However, Obama and Boehner were close to a major budget deal with entitlement cuts and tax increases on the table. Deal fell through when neither were able to get the support of their own parties for the deal. My hope is that they can go back to that deal or a Simpson-Boyles deal. Sadly I am already reading articles speculating that any deal will be to kick the can down the road a year or more. To the Greg Peck questions: Your idealogy can not be so rigid on either side that you sacrifice the country for it. You were elected to represent all of your constituents regardless of office level. So you do so while trying to stay close to your philosoply but you put your country, not your party first. And Eagle1: I channel surfed 5 different networks and not once did I even hear Gary Johnson mentioned. Barring a huge effort by both parties to compromise, I believe you are right that we are past the point of no return.

http://www.gocomics.com/nonsequitur/

If Republicans cared more about supporting and loving our nation, and less about undermining every move the President makes, we could move forward a hell of a lot easier!!

"WHY aren't republicans going after Obama for changing the laws of the constitution?" Examples please - after your research of course.

Here's a suggestion and a hope...obumma started out with a majority rule, which resulted in no results and Republican gaining control of house. Then obuma failed again to anounce any sort of budget, failed to come up with any compromise with house republicans...railroading obumacare (absoultly no house support) and a debt ceiling raise (keeping tax exemptions in place till the end of year. Now he is facing another debt ceiling raise, income tax experation, and 2011 Deficit Control Act coming due in 2013. Perhaps obuma should be the one doing a little compromising. He runs on the idea of change...maybe he should be the one doing it.

We are still clearly a house divided. Why are so many Republicans afraid of compromise?

The goal of Republicans to ensure Obama would be a one term president has failed. I hope this means Republicans will focus on strengthening this great nation, instead of trying to weaken a man. I hope this means our recovery will finally get going.

This is only a theory, but I think many wealthy business owners have actually been holding back these last four years. They didn't want higher gross income unless it came bundled with lower taxes. Knowing that it would take a Republican President to achieve that, the beloved job creators did not willingly participate in a recovery. They placed bets (re secret donations to anti-Obama super-pacs) to get a Republican in office. $6B dollars spent on campaign ads. More than half spent by pro Republican organizations. Think of how many jobs that could have provided.

However, even the wealthiest of individuals cannot sustain this level of non-action induced attrition for four more years. They now must participate in the recovery, and hope a Republican house can do something to keep the taxes low.

All of this, this slow recovery, in the name of greed. In the name of hatred. I suspect the recovery will finally start.

One thing fore-sure is that this election got every dead beat and wanna be's off there couch and out to vote, so they would not lose there benefits. With the old still in place they can move forward knowing they will be taken care of at the tax payers expense. I am afraid of what the future holds for us, and only time will tell if the democrats have voted for the right man or not. I am sure my husbands employer will be cutting hours or taking the penalty for not insuring. We pay $140.00 a week for insurance which I don't mind its fairly descent insurance.I can get into my Dr. right away. I am afraid under obummer care we will all have long lines to wait if there are any Dr. to treat us at all.

nomoreres, well put, the two party system is obviously broke and there are many accomplices that allow for it. Looking at the exit poll data and the results of the election, I have very little hope for the long term stability of this country. This is nothing new however it is starting to peak to the point we will not be able to recover. The fact both parties have no sense of urgency to correct it, basically by getting out of the way and being responsible is frightening. Even more frightening is the minions that continue to parrot soundbytes and talking points, most of which can be found on this site. I wasn't going to vote yesterday because as far as the Presidential race, I wasn't supporting Obamney and the third party option was slim to none even though I greatly relate to the Libertarians. But I looked at the polls and saw that there was a possibility that Gary Johnson could get 5% of the vote which would mean federal matching funds and guaranteed ballot inclusion in 2016, which allows the limited resources to be used in other avenues to communicate the message. Unfortunately Gary got no where near 5% many people I know that said they were going to vote said they were afraid he would take away from the lesser of two evils. That was a kick in the teeth as too how powerful the two parties are and how destructive they are that people can be that intimidated in the short term rather than support actual change in the long term. Yesterday was a very sad day for change, freedom and hope in this country. I really wish I had stuck with my original plan to not vote but I can do that in 4 years. I have only voted for one of the two parties for president once and I regretted it, I refuse to be sucked into the two party game.

My hope is that when Iran finishes their nuke program and tries to finish the final solution in the mideast that my Obamaphone will work long enough to schedule my appointment with my assigned medical doctor in case I should recieve wounds from weapons supplied to Mexican drug cartells.

My hope...To keep my job with the job killing taxes and new regulations that are coming down the "pipe" on the "evil" big businesses that hire people, who buy houses that are within their means, buy cars to get all points, etc.

My hope ..... that people will put love of country before love of party. My belief ....
(based on blogs such as this) that people would prefer to hate than to love. I believe this is true of both parties. Once again, we get what we collectively deserve. Sad, very, very sad. I'm confident many are already forming thoughts of justifying their positions before they have finished reading this post. I ask that you stop to think before doing so. How has this hate thing been working for you so far?

Not yet oldtimer, but we now have four more years to get there.

We are now the United socialist of America

Well... I guess it's back to the drawing boards for the plutocrats... They've got to realize that as long as they don't ban voting altogether, they won't be able to get rid of the pain in the butt "We the People" malarkey and get on with an oligarchic 2-class state. For starters, the masses need more bread and circus for them to be more docile and complacent next time.

All is lost...

If anything, there will be even less compromise than before between obuma and the House. We are facing another debt ceiling raise due in Feb...which will be blocked. Tax cuts are expiring and those will be blocked. I really feel for the next president who will be able to place blame on current president for years to come.

It's time for compromise from both sides. I think both parties have some good ideas on how to improve our country, and WI. None of those ideas will become reality, however, if they can't work together to find some middle ground. The days of divisive, extreme left and right politics need to end if we're ever going to see significant improvement.

I really hope my family and I can get a life boat off of this sinking ship!!

hd - I agree. But I do see a lot of the same old tired "issues" being raised by some of the same old tired posters out here.

The House of Representatives is keeping the USA intact.

My hopes are that I can successfully transfer my 401k into a roth 401k in the next 4 years so that I can preserve some sort of retirement...and that America isn't past the point of no return before next presidentail election.

"Pouting and holding your breath if you don't get your way is not leadership." Great Quote for all those that ran to the clock tower

My hopes are that ALL candidates will take a good look in the mirror, and be ashamed of themselves for the way this election was run on lies and misinformation.
Time to make an attempt on both sides to remember what has made this country so great, as in working together, and something called compromise.
It is real easy to remain negative, but now is the time for all of us to maybe back off a bit and see if we can't do a better job by working together.

Sigma, Why don't you quit your job and see what it is like.

The voters have concluded that returning the same people to power will yield a different result.

I was hoping for 5% by a third party to at least make headway in breaking the 2 party stranglehold, it didn't happen, once again clear minded people have nowhere to turn to voice their opinion.

I hope I can join the 47% by quiting my job and collecting something for free. With the incentive programs so high for not being employed and having 6 kids this is a great day for freeloaders and baby farmers.

Fortunately, economic cycles are inevitable. The constitution limits the politician’s control. We go a hundred miles an hour, at a virtual uncontrollable/ desired pace, building housing and automobiles until they aren't needed. People then complain if demand decreases for a time, until the products wear out or population increases. These inevitable cycles are controlled by "supply-and-demand". Some, as many as half, of the people in this country refuse to accept this as common sense. To change this reality, the constitution and its philosophical intent would have to change. I learned, last night, just how self destructive this country is capable of being.

Hope now we will get answers to the Benghazi killings, who knew what and when in the Fast & Furious program, why so many of the Green Energy Programs (Solyndra) have gone bankrupt and who benefitted most (since it wasn't the taxpayers).

It's better they get nothing done.

The Republicans were punished for their obstructionism yesterday. If they keep it up, they will just become even more irrelevant. People understand unfairness when they see it. Pouting and holding your breath if you don't get your way is not leadership.

Hopefully they can work together to better this country instead of undermining each other and getting nothing done.

Entitlement reform is needed? No! Tax reform is needed. How is it that Capone went to prison for tax evasion yet Mitt Romney walks free? His tax evasion schemes have been well documented in the foreign press. Apparently we all skipped over the part in the bible about using fair weights and measures.

I hope the Republicans undermine the President.

I could be a bum for the next 4 years and get all that free government help while raising our deficit

My guess is that the Repubs are already plotting to undermine the president in his 2nd term.