Nomores. And I can only guess from your so-called "logic" that you either are a janitor at Walmart, and I apologize to the other janitors for including you, or you work for Susan Rice's communications department.

donnaw, How you can derive what you have (your questions/comments of your most recent posting) is truly mind boggling. However, those ramblings make me partly glad that you are a former teacher - that part being former. I would hate to think that students would be exposed to that line of logic.

Nomores....where is your compassion for the workers who get an education and/or training, are dependable hard working people and raise thru the ranks thru their efforts.? Shouldn't they be paid more than someone who doesn't have the same education and drive. If not what is the motivation to succeed? Pay everyone the same no matter the effort sounds like socialism to me. Our society was built on people bettering themselves, getting an education and taking risks.
If you don't have an idea what a livable wage is how do expect to judge what a Walmart pays its employees or any other business or company for that matter?

donnaw, wealth envy - no, compassion - yes. I'm not commenting about the dollar figure per hour, I'm commenting about the living wage comment. That suggests something to me about how you feel about people. The reference to your teaching days was to suggest that you should have been able to recognize that some students would likely peak at low level abilities and would, therefore, not be advancing in the workplace like you suggested. They should still earn a living wage. I noticed that you do have compassion for the Waltons "No sleepless nights wondering how they were going to survive?" Somehow you seem able to project that compassion to the heirs of those fortunes, but not on the person limited by skills. It seems to me that I would lose more sleep not knowing if I would have food for the month vs. where do I put my next million.

Nomores .....little wealth envy on your part of the Walton's? Do you think that starting that business many years ago was easy? No risks? No sleepless nights wondering how they were going to survive? Those that risk the most should be rewarded the most IMO. And I'm sorry the three words I emphasized in my posting was too much for you to comprehend that occasionally people capitalize words for emphasis....Eyster capitalizes almost every other word.
So what is your idea of a living wage? $10 an hour which is $400 dollars a week isn't enough for a job requiring no skills? Keep in mind there are increases as the employee's tenure increases and they gain experience and a good work record. That's the incentive for good performance. Also what does my past experience as a school teacher have to do with an"living" wage?

donnaw, your imitation of Eyster's writing style does nothing to improve the credibility of your postings. If I remember correctly you've stated in earlier postings that you are a former teacher. If that is so then you should recognize that some individuals will likely not have the ability to advance beyond entry level skills. You referenced persons who are unskilled and persons with disabilities in the posting to which I responded. If they are able to perform the job satisfactorily (full-time) then I maintain they should earn enough for food, shelter and clothing, not living in the lap of luxury, but a "living" wage, as you stated. I don't think that's asking too much of the company you cited (Walmart). The Waltons all seem to be living pretty comfortably. I think it's unrealistic to expect someone to work 40 hours per week and not be able to provide for him/herself. I'm not talking about providing college funds and cars for eight children, just a "living" wage. I don't think that's too much to ask.

nomore....what I said was don't EXPECT to have an employer hire you for a living wage if you have no experience or skills. It is up to YOU, not your neighbor, your mother, your father, or the govt, to get an education, training to do SOMETHING for yourself. Yes, we all started out working the minimum wage jobs to get us started and we didn't EXPECT the world to hand us anything but an opportunity to make a plan for bettering our lot in life. That comes with working at goals, not having our hand out for a free ride. Most of us were raised to believe if we wanted something we had to work for it.

donnaw, so your common sense must suggest that someone should be happy about working a full-time job which doesn't allow him/her to live on, is that correct? Common sense? According to Samuel Coleridge: "Common sense in uncommon degrees is what the world calls wisdom". I don't think you're approaching that.

nomore....reality and common sense of which I guess you have none.

"You can't expect to apply for a job with no skills or experience and get a "living" wage. That's unrealistic." - donnaw, you can't be serious. How do expect one to survive?

Walmart hires unskilled workers and also those with disabilities. You can't expect an employer to pay more than about $10 an hour for unskilled workers and still make any profit. It's called competition. I'm sure your workers probably had some skill levels that warranted a higher wage. After learning the job, having a good work record, taken some classes or training, a worker can move up the wage scale. That's the way it's usually done. You can't expect to apply for a job with no skills or experience and get a "living" wage. That's unrealistic.

Yes I do know. I had a small business for 30 years,and my employees were paid above and beyond minimum wage and not once did I think that if I had paid them less I could have that much more money in my pocket. If I could do it why can't Walmart and the likes.

justchillin....there are still employees who realize that the people who start companies take big risks with their life's savings to start a compan, going thru lots of red tape with tax forms, registrations, licenses, approvals, etc. You think it's all gravy. You don't realize the long hours, the fear of failure and the debt, not only for you but all the employees. The employees have a responbilityto help make the company successful too. Get the proper training, show up to work on time, treat the customers with respect, etc. Its a two way street. If a company can be profitable so will the employees. Yes there are companies who don't treat their employees well but there a vast many more who do. Just like there are employees who show up for a job interview dressed like they are going to a barn dance, can't speak or write decent English, and have no training for anything.

Who said anything about unions? Don't you think it's just common decency to treat your employees fairly? Please name all these companies that you know are paying a living wage so those people out there that need work can go and apply. Unemployment solved!

"If these "right to work companies" would invest in their employees instead of pocketing all the profits, they might find that there would be more productivity, less turnover and happier employees."

There are many "right to work" companies that are productive, have low turnover and have happy employees. If this were not true, then unions would be in the majority....and they are not.

pro-artist made a good point when asking about why we aren't demanding to know what kind of jobs are being created? why can't we know what's coming?

I just read through these comments and my head hurts so much from absolute irrationality. It's the usual suspects of course.

What does Biden have to do with how Costco treats their employees?

wislady...how can you say that! Only Republican businesses are anti-employees! The left lives on hypocracies.

See any similarities here?

Gov. Snyder:
“Snyder, who previously had said repeatedly that right-to-work was "not on my agenda," told reporters Thursday he would sign the measures. “

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/12/...

Gov. Walker:
“Gov. Scott Walker said right-to-work legislation "would not get" to his desk but he declined to specifically answer if he would veto such legislation.”

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/news/15610...

Thanks...great example of hypocrisy!

Didn't Biden just have a photo op at Costco last week?

Biden Shops at Costco

"1:17 p.m. | Updated A time of austerity in the nation’s capital? Not for Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr., who went on a holiday shopping spree at a new Costco store on Thursday.

"Mr. Biden showed up for the grand opening of the discount chain’s first store inside the Washington city limits, joining the co-founder, James D. Sinegal, a prominent campaign fund-raiser for President Obama and Mr. Biden, and the company’s chief executive, Craig Jelinek, whom the president called this month to talk about the federal financial crisis."

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/...

If these "right to work companies" would invest in their employees instead of pocketing all the profits, they might find that there would be more productivity, less turnover and happier employees.(Costco is a good example). The more jobs they have to work means less time to parent their children, help them with homework ect, not to mention the higher cost of child care. How does one get ahead. Everyone wonders why so many are on food stamps, well if you can find only one of these low paying jobs you can qualify for assistance, so who is at fault here? Everyone wonders why unemployment is where it is, you can still work at a low paying job and collect partial unemployment to make up some of the difference but certainly not all of it. Better yet if you can collect more in unemployment than working at a much lower wage at a dead end job what is your incentive to work at one of these companies. It was reported that companies had record breaking profits this year, so why are so many of us struggling to get by? All we need is a living wage so people can get off food stamps, get off unemployment and pay their day to day expenses. Is that just to much to ask for?

Carlito, if you make it too expensive for an employer to be in business...s/he won't be. And then even that lousy job you grouse about won't be there for you. OH, WAIT! You can just go on the dole and let the rest of us pay your way.

The fact that Michigan becomes the 24th state with "right to work", would seem to dispel a lot of the comments made here.

carlitosways

It is always interesting to see people wailing on about what others have. If you want more, do what many of us did. That might mean working several jobs to support the family, going to school part time to get a degree, and even putting in 60 hour weeks. Some of us have actually done these things. The fact is, sometimes we have to go without for a while, but in the end, it is possible to earn a good wage WITHOUT a union. I have worked for non union and union employees, so I know it is possible. The fact that I have some money put away, is nothing to be ashamed of, and it is MY money.
I do not know your work record or financial status, any more than you know mine. Do you think 40+ years in the workforce is enough? Do you think that whatever a person EARNED during that time is YOURS? You do not deserve what others have gotten through their own sweat. As far as compassion, I have given to many (even when I had little), and continue to do so. But, I will chose who to help and it won't be anyone with an opinion like you (who believe that just because I have something, YOU are entitled to it).
That is my opinion, and I have a right to say it. You can continue your hateful comments about me, or you can choose to do something about YOUR life situation. You do have a choice.

I am sorry if life is difficult for you right now, but many of us have also been in that situation.

carlit...I think you did puke....a huge paragraph of vitriolic words which made no sense. Where did you learn to write?

It is also the right to have a union bargain for your benefits and wages and have someone else pay the expense of maintaining the union. Typical of the right wing parasite class, that thinks you can have things without paying for them.

There is a difference between a right to work and a force to join the union or not work. Do you know what it is? It is the right to put your money, you earned, in your pocket, not some fat cat partying on your money!

California is NOT a right to work state and it leads the nation in POVERTY. Hmmm seems to fly in the face of the rhetoric.

"California has a poverty rate of 23.5 percent, the highest of any state in the country"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/14...

Wow, suprised anyone is still alive in all those right to work states. Based on the previous ignorant comments, not facts, people might assume people are dying of stavation while working 200 hour weeks making 2 cents per hour in those terrible states that offer a CHOICE for workers to belong to a union and dont REQUIRE it.

If you make an ignorant comment , you are by definition an ignorant person. Something you have great experience with.
You have the choice RIGHT now whether or not whether to work in a Union environment or not. No one forces you to work anywhere! Union jobs are almost always better places for employees, better wages, better benefits, better working conditions. Why would you choose lower wages , no benefits and......Wal Mart?(the largest private employer and welfare recipient in Wisconsin) Right to work is a tool for EMPLOYERS to be able to low ball people. The United States of Right to work is becoming people working 3 part time jobs with no benefits. This is the America she and others n her mold want. Its not about some mythial "freedom" from a union. Nor is it about employment, its about employers. These people will not be satisfied until we live in Wal Mart's world, and they are the only employer.

A right to work state is not something anyone would want if they have a family as they will be unable to provide decently for them as the wages will fall and the rights of the workers will be nothing and job security is not even a option and of course wislady would think that is good as she has not a CLUE as to what a decent wage is and what is really needed to provide for a family without having to rob Peter to pay Paul, live paycheck to paycheck just to barely put food on the table, as she does not have an ounce of compassion for anyone that is not in her GOP mind frame. her comments make me PUKE. I have a right to express my opinions as that is my opinion of her.

fearandrhetoric4dummies

There is a difference between calling someone IGNORANT, and telling someone not to make IGNORANT comments.

"Now the residents of Michigan, along with all the other right to work states, won't have the healthiest, most productive, and longest living residents!"

Michigan has very high unemployment, maybe it is time for something different.

Why do some of you believe it is wrong to allow people the freedom to choose whether or not to join a union or pay union dues? A "right to work" state does not take away the rights of others to collectively bargain, that is protected by Federal Law.

What does the election have to do with what went on in Michigan today? The control is the same as before the election, on the national level.

The positive for Wisconsin, Governor Walker and republicans have control of all branches of government.

"Green" Hmmmm... More money going to things that do nothing maybe? Probably jobs to be paid for by the taxpayer? Enough fluff! I want to see 'cogs' being built, assembly plants being put up and energy resources being tapped into. We need real jobs! Our country is being taken over without a shot being fired. I hope this is not what I think it is when the 'disclosure' is made. Why the secret anyway? Ever notice groups change rules whenever they want to hide something? Once it's in place, then you cannot change it. So much for transparency.

Wislady: Obama 332 Romney 206
Democrats won more seats in the Senate and House.
Democrats won more popular votes, by a long margin, in the House, but due to gerrymandering, did not win more seats then they should have.
Paul Ryan lost VP, Janesville, and Rock county.
Senator McConnell, who promised a one term President, today fillibustered his own bill.
How many times do you looney tunes need to lose?

Yes, wislady! Now the residents of Michigan, along with all the other right to work states, won't have the healthiest, most productive, and longest living residents! Let's rejoice and say a prayer to the supply side Jesus.
Contrary to Republican opinion, a state that passes right to work legislation does not make it automatically more conducive to business.
It's largely symbolic and will largely have no impact on business in Michigan. That same would go for WI, when Walker and his merry gang of reality denialists try and pass similar legislation here.
Fantasy for the fantasy crowd.

Even 4 Republicans voted against the Michigan law. And the Democrats walked out. Great bi-partisan work.

belman
You have no CLUE, so quit making ignorant comments.

That is great news ! I am so glad for them,hope it works out !

My bet is on a jail or prison.

Wislady you are a piece of work and I hope your family has to work for lower wages. Seeing that you don't seem like you ever had to work for a living.

Wislady you are a piece of work and I hope your family has to work for lower wages. Seeing that you don't seem like you ever had to work for a living.

Just wanted to share the good news, garyprimer.

Now you can move to Michigan and go to work!

I wonder how much public tax money is going for this secret deal?
I'm just sayin'...

Right to Work has passed to Michigan House by 58-52 !

If giving tax breaks brings new business and devolpment to our state, open the doors. Any business owner that can provide, and survive without union involvment, will grow, and when they do, wages and benefits will too. Greed and entitlment attitude, is what closes work places. Hard work and dedication would be rewarded. IMO.

Perhaps the real question - and ANSWERS - the public should be demanding is what kind of jobs? 240 jobs at minimum, unlivable wages are not sustaining to anyone except the business owners who could already be getting tax breaks, environmental breaks, local infrastructure tax-payer investment, and more.

Guess it's not entirely secret.

Now if the 5600 other Wisconsinites who filed for unemployment last month can find jobs we'll break even.

Even the dimwitted should understand the meaning of this.

Yep yep....Darn Walker.....
And for slow ones....this is meant a SARCASM !!