whinning?

The Bigger Picture. When the whinning slows down, its the bigger picture.

pat, if you know of a violation of funding rules, contact the Inspector General.
http://www.recovery.gov/Contact/ReportFr...
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The state website says that the city received $4 million in Clean Water funding.
http://www.recovery.wisconsin.gov/arramo...
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The funding rules don't apply to the remainder of the project, so even if a turbine was outside the scope, the city would still be free to fund one on its own. The full article published at 4pm indicates that $175,000 of the turbine cost is covered by Focus on Energy, and most definitely would be for renewable energy projects. This money comes from the state and is specifically allocated for conservation to reduce the need for building new power plants in the future.
http://www.focusonenergy.com/Incentives/...

The stimulus was for upgrades to the sewer facility, at least that is what the state said when contacted.

Sorry but referring to it as a pinwheel shows how bias you are against renewable energy. You don’t consider renewable energy an upgrade? By the way the stimulus was to include renewable energy.

I don't think anyone said the turbine cost 7.2 million. But the stimulus money was suppose to be for upgrades , not a pin wheel. Like I said abusive and impulsive spending by our city gov.

This turbine did not cost 7.2 million it is part of a 7.2 million set of upgrades that are required. The approximate installed cost of that turbine is in the range of 400,000 dollars. That is an approximate cost to purchase and get it up and running.

City officials have said for months that is will years and years from now show evansville some savings, be it a small percentage. So by their own admissions it is being used for Evansville.There is more to the story than what you can read here. You really would have had to go to the meetings and read the minutes to get the full story on this.

It is over 8 million and the city paid for over half. They did receive stimulus funding but that was suppose to be for upgrades to the sewer facility NOT for a pinwheel. Abuse and misuse of stimulus money by the city. Remember this stimulus money is not free money. WE are all paying for this pinwheel and the incompetence by the city council.

First, who says evansville paid 7.2 million for this on their own? Where does it say any of the money is evansville's? Second, who says this is to "power" a city, or even a part of it? Read this part.."The upgrades are needed to comply with state Department of Natural Resources nitrate standards that have changed since the facility was built in 1982. "

Has is occurred to anyone that 1) The turbine was paid for by the state or government or private source? 2) Has it occurred to anyone that there may be tax breaks and other options available for this? 3) Has anyone thought that in the big scheme of things, like reducing our carbon footprints, maybe this would be nice for people/students to go out and study? 4) In reference to adhering to the DNR's nitrite standards...possibly this turbine is only meant to supply some sort of substation or small element of the DNR with free power, to maintain a self-sustaining office/station? This may only be installed to ensure free power to one building, an important building.
I think in th ebig picture of things, this is good in many aspects of learning and growing. Kids from surrounding colleges can inspect this turbine in their studies. I don't see what everyone is so MAD about this for? Since when did green energy become bad? And more importantly, where is your more cost effective, easier to maintain, and greener alternative? I haven't heard one suggested yet.

Glad the turbine is coming. I see nothing but good in the short term and long term.

I have never argued against any of those points. What I stated was from the information given from the manufacturer and as such is under optimal conditions. These turbines capture energy from the wind, you don’t have to pay for the wind all you have to do is pay for maintenance which you need to do on any device creating electricity. How is that a bad thing? How much energy dose your car get out of the gas that it uses compared to the potential energy in the gas? About 30% in the more efficient vehicles, yet there is not a large uproar about that.

mespl,
How nice that you are interested in the details. The 32.4 would be right if the turbine was always perfectly optimized into the wind. They never are so that’s why I added a few MPH. Go to this web site to see a Northwind 100 running in real time. It shows the yaw position of the turbine rotor relative to the actual wind direction.

https://smartview.northernpower.com/publ...

Here is another detail for you, something called the Betz Law. According to Betz's law, no turbine can capture more than 59.3 percent of the kinetic energy in wind. This has never been disputed by the wind industry and would be another factor that will significantly limit capacity factor. Check it out on Wikipedia.

kitfox: The nameplate capacity is at 32.4 mph not 35 or higher as you state, minor correction however easy to look up. This turbine also starts producing power at 7.8 mph which is actually quite low for a turbine and one of the large advantages of this particular model. If anyone purchases a wind turbine thinking that they are going to get the nameplate output of the turbine 24 hours a day forever then they obviously never consulted anyone prior to the purchase. The capacity is exactly that the maximum output not the average given the operating conditions.

I am glad the city is putting this in, yes energy savings might be low now however energy costs only do one thing and that is go up so the savings will increase with time. Please give this project a chance and try to accept it as progress, I would much rather have this in my backyard over a coal power plant.

badgerboy,

Let me put this a different way. Including today there were 8016 hours for production of electricity in 2009. The Medford turbine has been turning 7087 of those hours or about 88% of the time. In that time it has produced 58,796 kwh of electricity or about 8kwh per hour of a possible nameplate capacity of 100kwh. That’s an 8% capacity factor. There is no smoke and mirrors here, that’s all it is able to produce.

This turbine will rotate 88% of the time but produce only 8% of its nameplate capacity. There is nothing extra to sell or to be used by anyone. For this turbine to produce anywhere its nameplate capacity the wind speed in Evansville would need to be 35 mph or more continuously 24 hours a day. Just because you see the turbine blades turning this is no indication that it is producing any meaningful amount of power.

Get it now.

IT was already stated by city council and administration over the past months the savings will be minimal. They have acknowledged that. I doubt there will be anything to sell to alliant.
It was about status, about being a spoiled child and wanting the big toy.

kitfox sez: It produces at 8% of its nameplate capacity. Who in there right mind would purchase anything that works only 8% of the time?
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8% of rated capacity does not, repeat DOES NOT mean it's only working 8% of the time. If this 8% supplies the required amount of electricity, then the remaining amount can be sold back to Alliant.

Because of the size of this turbine, we will see very little savings after maintenance and wages for the up keep. It is a small turbine in comparison to some of the ones you see in fields across the country. This was nothing more than Evansville trying to get on the map in terms of being 'green' at the expense of taxpayers. Once again bad decision making by our council.

Evansville has the second highest taxes in the county, and spending like this is one of the reasons why. This project has already gone over 8 million.

You'd think Evansville taxpayers would like the idea of free energy from the sky, especially when they have an expensive new water treatment facility to pay for. But judging from these comments, they'd rather pay Alliant.

purchased with taxpayer money, everyone's, and it only works 8% of the time. The only thing Evansville knows is how to spend money.

Ezoner, this turbine is being purchased by the GOVERNMENT. You have said in previous posts that the government can't do anything right. Why is this O.K., but anything else isn't?

beeferer - i must agree - me no understand!?!

Evansville is the same town that had to lay off employees, mandate furloughs, put in place a wage freeze ( no raises unless you are lucky enough to be under a contract or union.) I wonder how those laid off feel about the city cutting their position because of the budget, yet can buy toys.

dependancies, imparative, benifical, implimentations, excelerate, advancments,...?

The City of Evansville must be in terrific financial condition in order to be in a position to buy such a novelty item like a toy wind turbine in such exceptionally hard economic times. I think the money would have been better spent on the worlds largest teeter totter or something similar so they could advertise it as a tourist attraction.

To see the actual production (live) of a Northwind 100 turbine go to this web site.

https://smartview.northernpower.com/publ...

This turbine has produced 58,796 kwh of electricity in 7087 hours of operation since Jan. of 2009. It produces at 8% of its nameplate capacity. Who in there right mind would purchase anything that works only 8% of the time? The City of Evansville. This turbine is located in a class 2 wind area just like Evansville.

Once again the rate and tax payers will be forced to pay for something that doesn’t work.

And then there will be the noise… At night… When people are trying to sleep…

For those unfortunate residents that will be within ½ mile of this turbine demand a property value guarantee.

Have they talked to a qualified Acoustical Engineer with wind turbine expertise for siting recommendations?

I really can't believe people. They complain about rates (utility), they complain about parking, they complain about everything. I see this as a positive step. Wind mills have been around for hundreds of years. It's only now that people feel there is an issue. There are pumps running, AC compressors, cars, motors of all types. People need to get a grip.

One thing I do agree with is why only one turbine? I would have suggested two, and possible make one a vertical turbine, to compare performance, allow for maintenance. Wind should be coupled with solar, so that when the wind doesnt blow, the sun may shine.

People should also note that wind patterns are the best in the midwest. This industry offers the midwest an opportunity for jobs.

I'm amazed that someone who goes by the name creativethinking has so little of it. Own a bunch of power company stocks do you?

I am sure we will all adjust, just like we do every time they screw us over. If we can not adjust we will have it shut down.

This is just a bunch of crap!

get ready for the January water,sewer, electric bill is set to double according to our friendly council.

these belong out in fields far away from residential areas. They do not belong in towns close to residential areas. I researched this company and they have had issues all along, have been sued, and have had turbines shut down due to noise. New energy resources are great , but not in town. This one is considered 'small.' and cost for maintenance, and to run, makes how much it will actually save very minimal. Another horrible idea by mayor decker and our council.

Actually in Evansville people have complained about the train and car noise. IF the noise is like what is has been in other areas where these have been placed near residential areas, NO one will forget or ignore or get used it, and it will get shut down. This same company that is placing this turbine has been sued several times already for noise issues, and the turbines in question were shut down by a judge. ALSO this is a relatively small turbine compared to others and how much it will actually 'save' is minimal. They 'council' members have already acknowledged that.

The changes necessary to combat our dependancies must start now. To conserve, and have stand-by reserves (energy) are imparative. There will be some discomfort along with such changes, as there always are until the benifical outcomes display themselves.Little spurts of implimentations spread the positives of these changes and they will excelerate in due time as always. It is just the initial shock at first that will prompt reactions. History shows this with many advancments in technologies. Areas that can support this type of power should be utilized. Just as solar is more benificial in certain zones. Geothermal in their respective places. And the list can go on. I support such moves, as will the detractors in time.

Creativethinking - wind and thunder makes noise to. Do people complain about that? Trains, cars, animals all make noise also. After awhile, you don't hear it. People will complain about anything.

It's to bad they can't afford it, and had to double people's water rates in order to do this. I think they can keep in mind if this creates the noise that others have, it won't be running for long.