GM will decrease production of full-size SUV

I just want to say that I worked at the plant from June to December. At any given job I could have three power tools I had to use-and no, not one for each bolt. A person that works there may say "I snap on windshield wipers." And maybe that is their job. I can guarantee you that that's not the only thing they do for that job. One of my jobs when I was there-and for the most part it was during the summer when the temp in the plant went way over 100 degrees-I put on the generator. Easy, right. Just set it up there and send it on its way. I didn't mention the handful of hardware I had to attach using several tools too to other parts of the motor. I just put on the generator. After six months of working there I couldn't close my hands every night. You may thing that would be the case doing a new job but a couple jobs I did for months at a time. I'm just saying-my job before that sucked. I think I deserved more money than what I was paid. The company didn't pay it. I'm not going to say GM employees are overpaid because that is what the company chooses to pay them and believe it or not there is hard work involved. But go ahead and blame the employees.

two cents. i really dont feel the need to tell you exactly what i do there. because i feel you will only pare it down to what you think i do . why dont you tell me what you do so i can tell you how someone somewhere else does it for way less money. i dont think gm is the be all end all of janesville but lets face it more money spent in our local economy by people who earn their living at the plant is a good thing. i havent worked at the plant forever . ive also worked at several lower paying jobs around janesville so i could feed , clothe and house my children, and i think if gm would have left back in 86 even those jobs would have been less in number. and honestly i am really done apologizing to anyone that i finally have a job where i work hard for ten hours a night during second shift (missing my children growing up )for great pay. yep i said great pay. i am glad i make the money i do. i wish it was possible for everyone to pull a good wage .now if youll excuse me i must go live my life not giving a care to what you think about me or my fellow workers. go ahead have the last word . im letting you

Momo5

"There is something wrong when Nissan can compensate their workers some $30 less an hour than domestic car makers. However, it is not the fault of our local GM employees. Fixing the problem starts in Detroit and DC"

Yes, there is something wrong with the GM business model. Gov't intervention is not the answer. On the other side there is very little wrong with the Nissan model-when these companies build plants in the US people want to work there-no one is forced to work there.

There are some poor gov't social policies in Japan that contribute to the competitive nature of Japanese auto companies; however, on balance, today Japanese companies build products that consumers want.

US companies were caught with their pants down. With the exception of full size trucks and SUVs, Japanese and other foreign auto companies have owned the market for the last 20 years. While US companies performed OK, the Japanse companies consistently built better products which cost less than similarily priced domestic cars. One reason toyota is the number 1 producer is because toyota built products that people want.

US companies have made big strides in quality over the last 15 years. The question to ask are those quality improvements to late? Many genration Xers are moving into their peak earning years and many will never consider a domestic vehicle due to the perceived lack of quality. The steps GM has made over the past few years, trimming excess unskilled labor costs(via buyouts), improving the quality and design of new products, divesting itself of non-core businesses-will help to GM improve its competitive stance in a global economy.

But the first step is building a competive product that consumers want. No more cadillac cimarrons....

2 cents asks: khulburt..you have completely avoided the topic and have yet to tell us what you do there???
What's this US stuff? No one asked but you, and I'm guessing khulburt thinks it's certainly none of your business. But khulburt invited you anyway to come and see (or better yet-try the work) for yourself. That should be enough to enbarrass anyone who has been babbling on about what they THINK they know (better than the employees themselves) about their own workload (and booze load).
But while we're at it-you didn't respond to me either when I asked you a question.

Khulburt says...snazzy in uninformed we make approximately 500 vehicles a shift times two shifts a day . and where is this four bolts malarky coming from. i work at the plant. and i have yet to see a job like that there. sounds like he is pulling his info from somewhere dark and scary on his anatomy

khulburt..you have completely avoided the topic and have yet to tell us what you do there???

If you work in the U.S. you are (according to some ) overpaid, no matter the position. There are people outside the U.S. that are willing to do the same work for less.

Even professional positions are vulnerable, there are stories about people traveling to other countries for cheaper surgeries, dental work etc.

As far as work content goes, the Janesville G.M. employees, as a group, are a very dedicated hardworking bunch. Anytime you have 3000 people, some will be working harder than others, so an individual case does not stand for the group as a whole.

sorry that comment was directed at two cents . but honestly sometimes its seems like some of these posters must have more than one username.

dearest snazzy like i said, take a plant tour ,they are free i believe. and see what everyone does there.and as for me not liking your bolt theory, i suspect a lot of your "facts" in any conversation would be only theory or maybe just things you wrongly imagine to be true. or things you exagerate so you can be top dog in any debate you have because you need to feel superior. get educated about the topic, ask your friend for a summer application if the opportunity arises and then you can spout off at the mouth

2cents, that is not all your friend does, just part of it, and you know it. You're saying he/she works maybe 4 seconds out of each minute, and 1500 people a shift must do similar? Tell me then, how do they get 500 cars built a night? Using your "facts", that would mean each car takes the entire body of workers (including foremen and all the other employees), about 20 minutes or less to build, start to finish. (Picture that in your head.) Don't be a boob.

coffeeman,
I agree with you. For those able to remember back that far, think back to 1986. That was the year GM offered transfers to Fort Wayne. One could buy a house in Janesville for well below market value compared to years prior. Why? Because there were a lot of homes for sale. I am afraid history would repeat itself if the plant closed up shop. And, snazzyj1977, I do agree with you as well. There is something wrong when Nissan can compensate their workers some $30 less an hour than domestic car makers. However, it is not the fault of our local GM employees. Fixing the problem starts in Detroit and D.C.

Khulburt, I have a friend who snaps some piece onto the winshhield wipers. You didn't like the bolt theory. So set us straight. What do YOU do there?

ill give him credit when his statement includes all facts and not just facts that suit his purpose

Snazzy says: "Bottom line, no one should get paid $25 an hour to screw four screws into 50 vehicles a day. Period."
He's right!! And so it just plain doesn't happen that way.
He's also right about the $25 an hour. At least that. And it's earned.
And he's also right when he says: "Don't like it? Tough."
Give the man some credit for being right part of the time.

if nissan was in the gazette everyday you would gripe about them instead. unless of course you actually work there. is that the case?

snazzy in uninformed we make approximately 500 vehicles a shift times two shifts a day . and where is this four bolts malarky coming from. i work at the plant. and i have yet to see a job like that there. sounds like he is pulling his info from somewhere dark and scary on his anatomy

Bottom line, no one should get paid $25 an hour to screw four screws into 50 vehicles a day. Period.

Cost of a Nissan employee - $41 an hour including benefits.

Cost of a General Motors employee - $71 an hour. You figure out why they are slumping in profit and why closings are pretty common lately.

Overpaid. Period.

Don't like it? Tough.

RN the mortgage crisis was not caused by people living above their means. Read the paper once and a while.
I feel bad there are that many people that are going to be losing their job.
The sad thing it's only going to get worse before it gets better. So with that said, brace yourself people the worst is yet to come.

coffeeman, I never said that I don't like GM or it employees. They work for a living just like the rest of us. Generations of my family have worked there. Of corse this city would be hurt a lot if GM closed but, it would not be the end of us all. It is just that Janesville has changed. As a life long Janesville resident I remember the days when you couldn't throw a stone without hitting someone that worked at the plant. We had 7 families just on our block that worked there. Today you do not see that. In the last two homes we have had only 2 families worked at GM and 1 at Lear. The majority worked in other citied like Whitewater, Lake Gaveva, Madison, Rockford or one of the other diverse business in town. I would like to think that Janesville is a nice enough city if the plant closed and people moved away that people from other towns would move in. Is that not what happened in the 80's when everyone though that the plant was going to close and moved to Fort Wayne.

To get back to the point of my other comment. It was not that I don't like GM employees at all. I was just sick of see this story still up. How long has it been there? We all get it, some like GM, some don't. That will never change. There are times that the Gazette covers it like the rest of the world has stopped. I will say that now that I am out of the GM circle, I can see why people that don't work there get sick of hearing about it. This is a nice city and untill I stopped being surrounded by people that work at the plant I did not realize just how deverse this city is in its employment. Living in this city and not working at GM is like being at a party with new mothers and being the only one without kids. After awhile you would like to here about something else.

As someone who has worked in and around GM in the past I'd like to add some thoughts. I am a former supervisor at TNT and Lear. I'd like to first say there are many decent people at both GM and Lear, or LSI for that matter. However, the bad ones I encountered were some of the biggest scum I've run into in my 20 years in the working world. These low lifes tend to stick out and be more memeorable than the good folks which is sad. There were also some terrible upper management at these companies...drunks, sexual harrassers etc. I used to have a really big grudge against the the GM/Lear people, but again it was the pathetic 5% who were the primary cause and we all know these 5% are not reading online newspapers and writing comments. I do still belive unions do more to protect the poor worker than reward the deserving. How great a world it would be if the day came where the 95% would confront the pathetic 5% and tell them where than can go. Best of luck...if you're in the auto industry, which I thankfully left, you'll need it.

greenst says that Janesville is not GM. I am NOT a GM employee but I have to disagree. If you think Janesville is not GM, let them go away and see what happens to Janesville. The $140,000 home becomes a $60,000 home and only then if you can sell it. I know there are many large companies in Janesville, but many depend on GM to survive. You may not like GM employees, but God save us if they go away. I had an opportunity to work there once and turned it down. Money was good, but strove to go on and get my degree. It paid off too. Get over it, because many large cities (and small) depend on large companies.

they have tours of the plant during production. and they dont warn us overspending drunk heathens either. come see that we dont all sit around playing pick-up sticks and drinking all night. i earn my money and i really hate mass generalizations

As a long term employee of GM I can tell you that at break time there are...
Those who sit and read
Those who have Bible study group
Those who watch the news
Those who talk to family / friends on the phone
Those who eat / cook
Those who study for education
Those who exercise
Those who take walks
...and yes those who go to the bar

There are 3000 employees, it is a community, a diverse community and as you find in any community you will find those ( a subset group) who do not like their position and will do things like drink. Drive by the bars not by gm on a work day and you will see people who are not gm people at the bar, after all it is a community.

You’re telling me! The stories were just news stories to me, just like any other story. Important, of course, to a fair percentage of Rock County, just like school news, Mall news, whatever. 100% of the news will never be important to any one individual, I sure don’t have to tell you that. I can’t imagine anyone saying “Quit writing about this subject or that subject-it does not pertain to me and I’m tired of it!”-can you? They won't stop printing school news because you don't go. Anyway, even the stupid negative insults, unrelated to the (GM) stories as a whole didn’t bait me at first-and I’m sure they were designed to inflame-and besides, I really didn’t have time to comment on them until now. But then, in a really, really unrelated story about the Department of Justice and some employees being let go for misconduct on and off the job located here: http://gazettextra.com/weblogs/latest-ne... wahoo_35 saw fit to compare them to GM workers by saying “The lab worker sounds like he/she should work for GM. I have seen many workers come in drunk.” Why?? How was that relevant? Talk about something being shoved down people’s throats every day. So, I finally commented. Would you not speak up for the unique and diverse individuals you cared for and respected among the whole body of people being slammed as if they were some sort of mutant identical beings? If not-why not?
But you’re right-enough is enough. (hint: if you did not comment on this story-it would stop showing up in the “popular discussions” area-it is not a new story every day-but c'mon, admit it-you're looking in here right now to see if someone commented, aren't you?) I feel much better now. Thanks for letting me vent, too.

Why wont this story go away? how long has it been here? Go away GM story, Go away PLEASE. This just one more reason people get upset with GM in this town, it is shoved down our throats eveyday. GM may be in Janesville but, Janesville is not GM. Gazete please, we do not need to know evey little thing about GM. Do you think you can go a couple days without a GM story. There are time that I feel like I am reading the company newsletter with this paper.

I feel much better now. Thanks for letting me vent.

I hope that all of you lovebirds are having a good time with your chat room. Does anyone care to comment on the story?

And good morning to you too, 2 cents, what another ray of sunshine! You misinterpreted my point, as was to be expected by the many "happy" bloggers on here. I'm not bragging that we have our cars paid off, after all they are 4 & 5 years old, they should be. Guess, they really aren't newer when I think about it, but we keep our vehicles and take care of them. If you think $140,000 is some grandiose palace, rethink it. The average price of a home in this town is $180,000-$200,000. Do I get any credit for coupon shopping or buying used clothes, or is that bragging too? My husband hasn't been there 30 years, only 13. Yes, we are very thankful for his good paying job and benefits -we never take it for granted and realize that it could all be taken away - hence why we live within our means, unlike the majority of Americans (even non-GM employees). Of course, if he would loose his job we could live on my income as a nurse, but I'm sure in your thought process ALL nurses are overpaid, lazy drug addicts because we have medication in close proximity to where we work! It's funny because we have many GM friends and when we get together no one complains about their jobs - not sure who you're hagin' with - some other uplifting, postive folks (birds of a feather...)! Of course my husband knows that there are some that drink on their lunch - he doesn't have blinders on (or bifocals as per DartPlayer07 - I still don't get that comment). But why aren't you as equally upset by all the business people that you can see on any given day downtown having their "2 Martini lunches"? After all, they're drinking on the job. I can see that some people's perception of GM employees will never change, but let me warn you, all your negative energy affects target organs and you could end up with sickness down the road. You need to go do some yoga, let go of your hostility, and thank God for what you have. There will always be people that have more, but also many that have far less than yourself. RUSerious, nice try at yet another attempt to explain things rationally to these people, but they have their "facts" and they need to hold on to that! So lets all hold hands and sing Kumbya.

Well, RN-thanks for your comments, but you are right. When these people know somebody who knows somebody who knows somebody (or like Dartplayer-she used to go with someone who worked there) who heard that GM workers drink on the job while half-heartedly attempting to occasionally put in some of their required bolts before running out and buying half dozen beers at a time every chance they get, only to go back and curse the company who put them in this god-forsaken position in life-there is no hope for those of us who only intimately know these very workers to convince the nay-sayers that the majority are hard working, sober, reliable men and women, happy and grateful for these jobs. What would we know? By the way-they are convinced that GM workers live beyond their means, so don’t be foolish enough to try to tell them otherwise, because then you are bragging about what you own. Haven’t you got the hint that they won’t let you win this one?
And certainly don’t state any positive truths about GM workers, only negative truths apparently are welcome (by these few). If we shut up, comments can be made about “Dartplayer not being the only one that stated they knew about the GM employees drinking on the job.” but no one would be here to remind these second hand experts that there are GM employees NOT drinking on the job. Then they could convince themselves that everyone believes in their expert knowledge. (By the way-I can’t recall, Dartplayer and 2cents, where did you get this inside info?)
It reminds me of how teen-agers, once they’ve discovered the opposite sex, all of a sudden know more about reproduction (and everything else) than their parents. But at least teen-agers grow up.
To paraphrase 2cents, “The point I am seeing in most of OUR posts is MOST GM workers ARE VERY glad they are able to make those wages.” It’s apparently other people who are not happy about it or they would welcome our views, and be relieved to hear other people know positive information about many GM workers instead of just this negative “blah blah blah”. And if this whole thing is only about a very few workers, why do they persist and not graciously let us have our say?
And certainly don’t bring up the community service (volunteer, not court ordered) and philanthropy of many GM workers-that would really throw a wrench into their cynicism.
So RN-I guess you better just enjoy your cookie-and be glad you have it-and be quiet. No one offered me one.

So miss goody two shoes RN isn't living above her means. Hand the lady a cookie. She is one of the few who can afford her $140,000 house, newer "paid-off" vehicle(s), no credit cards, blah blah blah. Notice she had to put out there what she owns!
As soon as someone states any negative truth about "some" GM workers, people automatically assume that someone is green eyed or showing ignorance. RN, you do know what assume stands for don't you?
Dart person is not the only one that stated they knew about the GM employees drinking on the job. Apparently you were too interested in their 59 posts and attacking them that they must be a negative person to even read what the rest of the people on here had to say. Are you going to tell me that your husband, after 30 years, doesn't know any co-workers that drink on the job or on their breaks??
People become consumed as you say, with the GM employees lifestyles, when they whine they aren't making enough money. There are not too many places they could go work for with that kind of wage. The point I am seeing in most of these posts is the GM workers should be glad they are able to make those wages. Many people work just as hard and don't receive that kind of pay.
PS. I wasn't raised here either.

RUSerious, good articulate entry attempting to clarify the average GM employee, but I'm convinced that some people in this community have their minds made up. I wasn't raised here, but moved here 11 years ago. I have always heard these GM stereotypes. My husband works on the line - his job take 58 seconds out of every minute to complete. How many could do this for 10 hours a day for 30 plus years? Believe me, the physical repetitive labor comes with a price to the human body. He has seen new hires walk off the line their first day because they can't take it. He doesn't drink on the job and never misses a day of work. We have a $140,000 home, drive vehicles that are a few years old and paid for, own no "toys", and have no credit card debt - oh, I also clip coupons & buy some clothes at consignment shops. So once again, we are not "living above our means" as previously stated. The majority of Americans live above their means as evidenced by the mortgage crisis and credit card load not just the GM employees. People seem to be so consumed with how the GMemployees spend their money and their "lifestyles". There are such bigger issues we should concern ourselves with in this community - and country! Why isn't anyone quick to point out the good that comes from GM - food & toy donations for the needy @ Christmas, donated time to Habitat For Humanity, and others that I'm not even aware of. Momof5, you are correct - every profession has people with "chemical issues" - I've seen it in the past 18 years that I've been in healthcare. But, you never hear the community labeling others like you do GM employees. I can only attribute this behavior to having a green eye or ignorance. DartPlayer07, I browsed over your "59" enteries since joining 11/9 - I really think you could use your time more effectively than responding negatively to most articles - you tend to see the cup as "half empty" I've got to say. Why don't you go to Echo or House Of Mercy and volunteer - you'll appreciate all that you do have instead of being bitter about what you don't! Also, "it is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt" - Mark Twain.

Sorry Dartplayer-you didn’t say thousands, did you? It did seem implied, though. But-why the big deal if it’s only a few-comparable to many workplaces? In reply to your and other posts, I was just saying I know and “have saw” many of them sober. Many and often. But just how many would you say are lushes then? Give me a percentage. The number who could fit into Zachow’s at any given break time? That’s not exactly a plant-wide epidemic now, is it?
Also, how are your views of the workers any more valid than mine? (Not counting your apparent nightly count at Zachow’s-that’s an unfair sampling-it is a bar after all, but surely can’t hold more than 1 or 2 % of GM’s employees at once) But listen to what I said, too. I never said there wasn’t drinking there. I said drinking on the job was the EXCEPTION, not the RULE. Want proof? Go back over to Zachow’s and see how many workers AREN’T there on their breaks. Then take a GM tour, walk down the line and smell some breath-I bet you get a whiff of coffee (and earned sweat) far more often than booze. Go ahead-if you think it’s logical to use Zachows as a measure of GM drunkenness, I can surely use the actual workers on the line.
No kidding there are drinkers on the job. Tell me where there aren’t drinkers on the job-that would be news. I have no blinders on-nor do I need bifocals-but that was silly anyway. Just because I had relatives who worked there at the beginning (long before I was born, by the way) doesn’t mean I don’t have relatives who work there now. And, I’ve had them in both union roles and management roles (but mostly just plain peons). Some drink (off the job) and some don’t.(and I have played darts-and even wahooed with many of them (off the job). The ones I mentioned in my previous post were to just point out to you that there are actually permanently, happily sober people working there.
And I said I know about six who take weekly communion (that was for comparison sake, I am not naive enough to think those “types” are all that work there either, nor does it matter)-I know and have known many more besides that. But- please feel free to pray for me anyway-and thanks.
But one thing we agree on-it would be nice if the jobs were only held by those who dedicate their ten hours a night to their work, who appreciate the money and the benefits, and who save their personal activities for their time off. Which reminds me, those people who say that GM workers whine about their pay, don’t live within their means, and all that uninformed garbage-it’s mostly just that. There are a few fools who might do that-(remember-the exception, not the rule) but I can tell you first hand-for the most part GM gets what they pay for-and those people appreciate it!
Oh-and thanks momof5

Momof5 wrote this on Dec 19th: Please don't throw stones at me and call me names, but a lot of the workers who go to Zachow's or slack off are not from the generation of employees from "years ago." (Define a lot)
So apparently she knows of those same people I speak of!
Let some of the people who want to be the workers RUSerious speaks of, have those jobs. The jobs that the drunks and slackers shouldn't have. Momof5 said herself they are given more chances than they deserve. (So GM does know of the drinking on the job and keeps giving those people chances??)
You people, who are oblivious to what is going on down there because you are from the "old school" ways, need a wake up call! Maybe what your fabulous family did for generations is the only thing that you know. That is not what is going on down there today.
My x-father in law wasn't one of those that was a drinker during his 40 + years at GM. Yes, I do know good people who work there too. Even using a Dart name, I know good workers. (EYE ROLL).
It's ok RUSerious, I'll pray for you at communion on Sunday. Until then, keep the blinders on, or maybe you need some bi-focals!

Well RUSerious...more like URDumb. I didnt say thousands but I know and have saw plenty of them drinking. Want proof? Head over to Zachows or whatever the bar is on the site and watch for yourself. Then come back and post. Wow good for you, you know the church going ones. (applause) There are others that do exactly what I posted.

RUserious: you read my mind! a BIG round of applause for you! The over-generalizations on this thread about GM workers is unjust. I know some worthless people who work at Mercy, Simmons, Alliant, etc.., Does that mean that the nurses at Mercy are all half-bakers? NO! Good for you for putting into writing what many of us were thinking!

This must be a text version of the bully’s “kick a man when he’s (perceived to be) down” syndrome. That's the only way a bully knows how to be on top. I am talking about the recent flurry of insults about GM workers, as if they are not as diverse as employees of any employer who hires many people.
I am from a “GM family” who has always had someone working at GM, ever since they were the Samson Tractor Company. I recall quite a few years ago when the Gazette did a story on the original sit-down strikers, my uncle was highlighted. Both grandfathers worked for GM, all before it was GM. None of them were drinkers. (...or did the drinking not start until the whole plant got the GM name, or maybe my family were the only ones immune?)
Being from a GM family and circle of friends, the stories of drinking are not foreign to me. But they are the exception, not the rule. Well, six or more GM people I personally know of do drink once a week, one ounce of wine at communion. Regularly and religiously. Literally. Care to spread another story based on that? I thought not. It doesn't fit your phony scenario. Just like the employees I’m aware of bringing their Bibles to work-who ever tells about that?
I had a “relative of a relative” who used to work for the Gazette about 15-20 years ago (or was it WCLO?) who was an alcoholic. How come it never occurred to me then that our local news entity employed a bunch of drunks? The quality of the work, for one thing, and common sense for another. Try the latter sometime, maybe a light bulb will go on somewhere.
Does anyone really think that big, powerful GM cannot control what goes on in any of its facilities, and has no power to keep several thousand people from carousing around drunk while attempting to put their required bolt in a vehicle once in a while? Union or no union, that’s just plain asinine. Where do all the vehicles come from, the car fairy? Even the union wants the decent and principled workers to be members of their organization, and occasionally has to put up with the dues paying riff raff. Happily, they are not as inclined to any more. Those strong members are the ones who will help both sides to succeed. Why do so many purchasers request that their vehicle comes from the Janesville plant?
Those people who “know” that the place is filled with lazy drunks doing nothing obviously are just personally familiar with that crowd and that’s their source of information.(note the personality traits probably evident in the chosen name of the negative posters: "dartplayer"-"wahoo") I’m proud to say that I know the others.

nobody,
No, I do not live in a mobile home and no, I do not work at Burger King, thanks for playing. I own my own business and my house is nearly 2000 sq ft. In fact, I do not even live in Janesville. I wouldn't want to work a day in your profession, just as I doubt you'd want to work a day in mine (or as a GM WORKER.....I'm talking about someone who puts more than a bolt in a fender!). Thank you for working for Alliant to put lights on in our homes and places of employment!

I know people who work at GM. They complain allllllll the time that they never make any money. Yet driving brand new cars, fancy houses, own top of the line tv's, stereo's etc. If they had a regular job like the rest of us and had to live on our paychecks it would be a different story. When GM was talking about striking, many were in panic mode. Why? Because they don't live within their means. If that plant closes down, Janesville WILL be a ghost town. No one would be able to afford to continue paying on what they are over extended on now. Yes, good for them, they got into GM. However, there are other good places to work in Janesville too. It is just too bad they don't get the paycheck that the GM workers do for working just as hard.
As far as drinking on the job. I dated a guy who worked there. Darn right they drink on their breaks. They have all their beer in coolers in the back of their GM pick up trucks. On break they all meet at someones truck right in the parking lot of GM. Also they have a bar in the lot. Walk in there some night at GM break time. They order 2-6 beers at a time so they don't have to wait in line and use up more of their break time. Then, it's back to work for the rest of the night.
Be thankful for your high paying job, quit complaining about the pay you make. Learn to live within the means of your check.
Merry Christmas!

*nobody,
It is obvious you are only 2% of your brain if you cannot use the correct variation of their in your postings and do not know the difference between where and were. I can honestly say that I would not want you doing any "electic side" work in my home!*

momof5,
sorry i dont work on mobile homes.
ok lets do this if i only use 2% of my brain why dont you come do my job then for a day.
let me guess you also work at gm putting bolts in a fender or something or do you work at burger king?

hell i will trade anyone day for day you do my job and i do yours.if you think you can run a power plant then lets go for it.

*nobody- i was just wondering you said you work on the eletric side ? did you mean to say the entertainment side?*

ihavealife,
no i am a power plant worker at alliant.

nobody,
It is obvious you are only 2% of your brain if you cannot use the correct variation of their in your postings and do not know the difference between where and were. I can honestly say that I would not want you doing any "electic side" work in my home!

Forgot "is" in my last post!

Keep in mind that drakkenrahl is only 17 and is in the public eye because of his Bible ripping incident at Parker. So, all of a sudden he thinks he noteworthy and should comment on everything in town. Ignore him--that's what kids at Parker should do, too.

nobody- i was just wondering you said you work on the eletric side ? did you mean to say the entertainment side?

the workers didn't want free pizzas'!!!! they wanted them delivered to the gates,they were told no we don't deliver to gates only to the doors.just a way of mixing things up again.people say gm has no impact on janesville businesses ,just ask the pizza joint if they were affected by the lost.

drakkenrahl. they striked? good one. everybody misspells but that is just hilarious. its not even a word. youve posted two comments on this site and neither one has any relevance or substance.

Its all good just like when they striked then they
can just go into the local pizza place and say
HEY were cutting back so just give us it for free!!.Weeee were GM workers!!

No Prob ....

unkbd, I thought you were seriously condoning the drinking. My bad.

C'mon Major, Gimme a break, my point was that after doing these jobs for so long these people can do them in their sleep, let alone with a beer or two in them. I don't condone it, but it happens. As far as being taken seriously there are a few others on the boards here that are a lot less credible than myself.

unkbd, WOW, for you to say that drinking on the job does not affect the quality of the product, you are certainly not someone to be taken seriously!!

As a student in college, I was selected to work as summer help at GM. I would honestly say it was the best experience I have ever had in my life, it was one of the hardest experiences also. I am thankful for earning enough money to pay tuition, and met alot of great people down at the plant. I believe that every cent that each and every worker down there EARNS. For people that have never taken the time to try a job down there for just two hours, I dare them. I can be confident in saying they will be sore, tired and mentally exausted. For people to go around on here and say that they don't earn their money, drink, and only use 2% of their brain are obviously frustrated with their own job, or have issues in their own life. Leave peoples career choices alone, and help a company that supports Janesville and many surronding communities make it through. Because without them, Southern Wisconsin would not be what it is today.

Mojo, management is not afraid of the Union. Why would they be? You do realize GM pays their wage too right?

Ever think that maybe they don't do much about the drinking because management drinks just as much? If you think they don't you are sadly mistaken.

Good point Blackirish. Most of the people on the line are doing anywhere from 3 to 5 items in a span of 10-15 feet. It leaves very little time in between jobs. And the more people that the company gets rid of the worse those jobs are going to get. Others who bad mouth the GM employee just seem to have an axe to grind and there is no convincing them otherwise. As far as the "drunk line worker" goes, I don't condone it in the least, but I will say this. If a person has done the same job (500 plus times a day) over and over for years, it becomes second or even first nature, like breathing, and it makes no difference in the quality of any given vehicle if that person has had a few drinks whether they were before during or after work.

Nobody, perhaps you could use that wealth of brain power you have and create a post with correct spelling and grammar. I mean, since you're so much smarter than everyone in a factory....

my2cents, I agree, maybe if the drinking on the job would stop, producing a more efficient, competitive car would be easier. But that is the same with all companies. I knew gm employees that would go to Who Cares bar on their lunch break. they would come into that bar already drunk, order 3 shots of jack and pund 3 beers and then buy 2 more beers to put in their lunch box for the afternoon. come on people, wake up! How blatent do people have to be before somebody says enough is enough. I support the GM workers. I buy their products, but I think if the management wasn't so afreaid of the union, they could get rid of the people that give GM a bad name. Sure, some of the work is hard and it is repetitious, so the hard working people there deserve all the pay and benefits they get.

benthinkin,
no what im saying is line work is not hard.i understand there are people there that have to use there brain to do there job just not everyone does.

"i cant really tell you were i work but its on the eletric side of things."

You may be surprised to know but there are many people at GM who "work on the electric side of things" too.

SO I guess that people who "work on the electric side of things" only use 2% of their brains according to your comment.

mollyd5
i work a 12 hour day and do shift work.

unkbd,
the reason i wont ever work in a factory is i dont need to. i have a better paying job than any factory worker.
i cant really tell you were i work but its on the eletric side of things.
line working is not hard im sorry to tell you its all repetitive motion.
so when you actually have to use more than 2% of your brain to do a job let me know.

later nobody

unkod you said a lot of good points i work in a local resturant and my husband works at lear.
people don't realize how many local small businesses are in this town. when gas is up you see an impact at those places. if gm lets some people go in march,so will the other places associated with it Lear etc.. domino affect. And to NOBODY i would love to know what you do for a living. people are hurt all the time at those jobs because they are constantly doing the same thing.It takes a toll on there bodies.when was the last time you worked a 10 hour day? maybe people who work at gm would rather by a honda or something else but gm is american made and y not since they get a discount, might as well by it. Foreign cars are gonna pass us up if the us doesn't start making the cars more like theres Besides does anyone relize that the us uses more gas then anyother country in the world.

I confess that I don't know why the employment numbers have been reduced over the years. Your assessment of how a closing would radiate throuhout this economy is reasonable. However bad, it will be perceived as worst than it is. But it won't be as bad as it would have been had all 7000 plus lost jobs at the same time.

Gazettefan:

The plant down to 1/2 of it peak employment due to operational effeciencies, correct? Employment is not down because some suit in Detroit said so.

The economic impact of GM on Janesville is huge. There are hundreds of business that would be directly and indirectly impacted by the loss of GM. Thousands, maybe tens of thousands of people could be affected by a closing. We all know that it costs US auto companies significantly more $ to produce a car/truck than its competition-this is a problem for Ford, GM, and Chrysler-its not going away. But the unskilled labor jobs might go away. Sure, the UAW will fight to keep those dues paying members but at the end of the day, the UAW cannot force GM to keep the plant open.

If GM goes away it will hurt Janesville. I remember when Parker Pen was thriving-where did it go? Janesville survived and the Janesville will survive if GM decides to move.

The plant is already down to half of its peak numbers. Its closing would hurt the local economy but most of that damage would come from the misperception as to how severe the damage is. Needless belt-tightening would happen.

NOBODY:" i just dont understand why someone would get payed 19-25 buck an hour just to put a bolt in a seat or put a fender on a truck etc...
people wonder why gm vehicles cost so much?
i am a gm person well i dont work there because i wont ever do factory work but i do like some of the vehicles."

I think you answered your own question...... my question is why won't you ever do factory work? Let's see, unless you are disabled in some fashion and physically can't, or maybe just because IT'S HARD. If you think that it is just putting a bolt in or a fender on I urge you to take a tour and actually go see what those people do. What they do they do 500 plus times a day and while it is moving towards/away from them.

It's not just GM and Lear. It is LSI, Trucking companies, Railroad employees, electrical contractors AMP , JP Cullen (how much money as gm thrown them over the years) When GM has change over in July people come from all over the country to work. Pipefitters, Millwrights, engineers etc., via their respective unions. I would be willing to bet that the immediate impact (those directly affected) would be near 8 or 9 thousand. The ripple effect, fast food, other restaurants, small businesses, even the big box stores. You don't think they just put those things anywhere do you? No they do research to see if the community is stable enough for them to make a profit, not cause the store would look good at the corner of such and such. The ripple effect could reach out as far as 20 to 25,000. Now you're talking about what ..... over 1/3 of the population. If you would like to see the effects of plant closings on a population take a drive to Michigan in and around Detroit. You would be surprised.

I'm sure most of you would say "no thanks" if GM or your employer called and offered you those wages. You'd probably tell them you just weren't worth the money too.

Incredible

Does anybody realize what would happen
to Janesville,Beloit and other surrounding communities if GM goes down?
I can't believe how cold and jealous
people are. Most people seem to want GM to close out of spite or jealousy. GM
and the wages they pay have done alot for Janesville like keeping property taxes down. People just grow up and quite being so petty & jealous of what other people have.

The wages at GM are the best when compared to other wages for similar types of work. There will always be wage dis-parity within a worker group.
That is one of the main reasons that people are always shooting down GM workers, because they are the top wages for the group.

If GM workers were paid low wages then the next group on the list would be the target.

The workers there know they have a good thing going despite all of what they don't like because the turnover rate is so low.

That said, everyone had a chance to apply there, if you did not apply, why should you be upset because someone else did?

It is just sad to see a powerful industry slowly die, but change is the only constant thing on this earth. GM wages have acted to buoy up everyone's wages in the area and I hate to see that standard slipping away. We cannot keep our standard of living and compete with third world countries and illegal alien workers. We have been sold out by our government for the favor of lobbyists with deep pockets. GM will probably do great once it rids itself of that pesky union. People forget that many fought and died right here in this country for a fair deal for workers. All of you critics please remember that a rising tide lifts all ships. You can choose to buy a new car or not, but you cannot choose not to pay taxes or to go to the hospital when you are desperately ill. And if you think those prices are fair and reasonable, I'd like to hear you defend them.

unkbd,
i dont really care about my punctuation, syntax.as far as my closed mind attitude have you talked to anybody else that doesnt work at gm and ask they what they think of the gm workers or the plant itself.i just dont understand why someone would get payed 19-25 buck an hour just to put a bolt in a seat or put a fender on a truck etc...
people wonder why gm vehicles cost so much?
i am a gm person well i dont work there because i wont ever do factory work but i do like some of the vehicles.

Edit #2: We ALL don't. In a group this large there are bound to be a few.

From Nobody,"unkbd,
so i take that you work at gm then.so tell me this why do all gm workers think they are above and beyond everyone else that lives in janesville.also why dont you support the plant and buy there junk they make at that plant.

i am smarter than what you might think!"

1. Yes I work there.
2. We don't.
3. How do you know what I drive?
4. Reeaaly?! Your punctuation, syntax, and seemingly close minded attitude tell me different.

Dartplayer: I think that the new Malibu and Impala are pretty sharp. Not to mention the Camaro for 2010 and the Volt. I think that GM is headed in the right direction, but I do see your point about being in time. Let's hope so.

unkbd,
so i take that you work at gm then.so tell me this why do all gm workers think they are above and beyond everyone else that lives in janesville.also why dont you support the plant and buy there junk they make at that plant.

i am smarter than what you might think!

unkbd sorry I typed it wrong

unbkd writes:The changes are coming around, new designs, options, the hybrids, etc. GM is finally making vehicles that compare and surpass the imports in quality, comfort and economy. Right now it is all about changing the GM perception.

My question..but is it too late??? I have always been a GM person, I drive a GM now. I have to say tho, the competition is looking better than what GM is putting out there.

NOBODY: Good to see a "genius" join in the discussion.
IHAVEALIFE: From my understanding those are the jobs the corporation wants to reduce/eliminate. The lines have yet to be drawn as to what jobs are core and non core. I was also under the impression that unless you actually put parts on the vehicle, or handled the sheetmetal (ie the bodyshop) your job was non core.
GREENST: If you think that GM needs to change, I would invite you to check out www.gm.com. The changes are coming around, new designs, options, the hybrids, etc. GM is finally making vehicles that compare and surpass the imports in quality, comfort and economy. Right now it is all about changing the GM perception.

shut gm down nobody cares if you lose your jobs

I would hope that people talking about "it's that unions fault" would get a better understanding of how unions work before speaking.

The union is an organization that is payed by it's members to represent them. This is akin to when someone hires a defense lawyer. If a person hires a defense attorney the attorney is required to represent them to the best of their abilities within the law. Similar with the union, if/when an employee does something wrong, it is the unions job to represent them within the guidelines of the contract. Management makes the ultimate decision on what happens to the worker.

Compared to its peak employment numbers, GM is already half closed.

In the 1960's, GM ran a series of experiments using monkeys to perform certain tasks. This was about the time that a chimp had become a celebrity for being the first primate in space. The monkeys had no problem learning the tasks, but soon became disinterested and bored, so the experiment was abandoned.

GM EMPLOYEES CAN THANK THEIR UNION ONCE AGAIN!!!!! IT IS NOT FOR THE WORKERS ANYMORE.