MIYATA
People use the park all the way to the creek with their dogs. The creek is what makes the PETA so wonderful for us. So until there is a line or some signs drawn showing where the dog park stops and starts, I imagine we have every right to be there with our dogs. They can't just expect people to pick an imaginary line. If an officer chewed you out, you should have pointed that out so that could be corrected.
I think there should be some commication from the city regarding the true perimeters of the park. How else are users supposed to know?

just some i here:
i am not criticizing amber's right to post.
she is stating things savethedogpark.com people are not saying.
the power of the forum is it gives us all the ability to speak up.
just like you with me.
amber was way off base.
shouldn't that be corrected?

booch11-Posting is what this is here for. Please do not criticize others when you have posted several yourself. Thank you in advance for consideration of others.

miyata312 -
For one thing, I never said PETA included the whole damn park. Next, cyclists have how many miles of paved bike trails in this area, why do you need to go to PETA? There have been several incidents back in PETA over the years concerning kids on bikes knocking people over, or almost hitting someone's dog. That's why no bikes are supposed to be back there. As far as the cops chewing you out - I think that is stupid. I would think our police dept would have more important things to worry about.

amber86:
you like tp post -- you really should spend some time at savethedogpark.com and look at the facts.

we are not at all concerned about kids "running to the freeway." we are very concerned that noise levels will affect a lifeguard's ability to effectively do his/his job.

I39/90 will expand. those plans are already on the table. when it does, noise and pollution will be even greater.

savethedogpark.com is very well researched.
perhaps you should check it out and become so yourself.

Well gilmoregirl, a few bikes have been knocked over on the road by irresponsible car drivers and people got hurt. Maybe we should ban cars from the road? Same accidents will and have happened on the paved trails.

And no the dog training area was never the whole damn park. It was just the area behind the tennis court to the interstate to palmer Dr. I know. I got chewed by a cop for taking my dog (on leash no less) down the dirt path into the woods near the mini parking lot on the corner of lexington and mohawk.

Sweetie LIZ
You must not have dogs and I think that is why most have ignored your rude comment.
The PETA parks are for our dogs to run off leash. Dogs don't always get that great of exercise on the leash. A lot of our dogs live to play catch. And NO-there isn't anywhere else for our dogs to run off leash other than the designated parks on either side of the city.
From May-Sept they aren't allowed in any of the parks(besides PETA), no school yards, no bike trails..etc. Just the sidewalks, our own yards, and the PETAs. So, to answer your question..since you are so baffled...there aren't a lot of options and we cherish what we have.
Just because you don't have a dog that you have a RESPONSIBILITY to exercise doesn't mean that it is wrong that we want to. Some of us of for the waterpark, just not at a park we already use daily. Why introduce a new park, but create another problem by taking a well used park away. It is used by hundreds of people all year round.

And we are all aware they are three dogs parks in the city. You have to remember that they are placed on three different sides of town for a reason. This is a good sized city with over 70000 people and so many have dogs. We can't all be expected to go to one park. We are grateful there is more than one option. If they take our park, they are leaving 2 sides of the city without anywhere to legally let our dogs run.

I-90 is not a mile away from Palmer Park. It's right there. When walking the most eastern path in the PETA you can see, smell, and hear the interstate. If you're talking to someone and you reach that eastern most path you have to wait to reach another path to continue the conversation or be willing to repeat yourself a lot. Now with the leaves being off the trees the interstate is even more audible throughout the trails. It is a favorite path though because of the way the pine trees form around and protect the trail.
There's a blanket of snow on the ground this morning and most of the parks will have that clean appearance for as long as this snow lasts, but the PETA even by now will have paths of footprints in all directions. After a heavy snow we are all grateful for the early risers who break the trails first.

I'd be happier with the PETA park if the dog owners cleaned up after their dogs. Just because it's outside doesn't mean you can leave landmines on the trails!

Why are people worried about I-90 ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Yes I-90 is like a mile away from palmer park What kid says YAY A POOL BY A BUSY INTERSTATE LETS RUN TO IT? GET REAL The interstate has nothing to do with this, but to bring in money! And about shoveling snow? What the HE** that has nothing to do with an aquatic center!

I have three dogs and it takes a good acre of land to play (throwing the frisbee and the ball) and run with them. Paw Print Park is 17 acres on the big dog side. So, if all of the dogs in Janesville that use a dog park are forced to use one park that would be very crowded and not enough room for a good game of fetch. At the PETA at Palmer we can walk the trails and play with the dogs without interfering with other dogs walk or play time. Palmer also has the shade of all those trees and a stream to help with the summer exercise. Paw Print has no shade or water and the dogs would just be running in the sun. The Afton Road PETA is just trails and there isn't a good spot for the retrievers to play. We love the Palmer Park PETA because of what it is naturally.

NO said, "Let's see, on the one hand you have 5-9 million dollars to be made by various agencies, contractors, vendors etc. and on the other you have a few dogs. Gosh, I wonder who's going to win this fight?"

if you care about this issue, sign the petition at savethedogpark.com -- the only way citizens can win is to participate.
the easiest way to do that is to sign the petition.

also, follow this link and read mike williams' comments (williams is the jvl leisure services director)
http://www.dailyreporter.com/item.cfm?re...

williams stated, "...Palmer Park looks like the most promising site.”

seren said:
"if aquatic park does happen, it will need to be located right off I-90 to lure $$$$"

funny, city officials have personally told me they do not want the aquatic park to be a major attraction. they do not want to have to wait in line for 'out-of-towners." if that is the case, and again, i have that straight from city officials, then why build it at palmer park. it makes no sense.

Maybe we could repeal child labor laws. That would give em something to do. Better yet. Any bored kid in this city is free to shovel my driveway this winter after each snow. Should take you from 1-2 hours to do it, you will be getting exercise and not be bored. And if you do a good job, I may even pay you. Like 3 bucks or so. :-)

Hey Amber, if you would have read my comment you would have seen that I agree with the aquatic center...so before YOU start FLIPPING out maybe you should read who wrote what sweetie!!!

Paw Print Park is open, it is not run by the city. It's run by a group of local dog owners. It's a nice place - you have to pay to get a permit. Plus, it's way on the other side of town.

Sorry, I forgot one. Again, the City of Janesville website states: "Paw Print Park
This is a newly approved dog park to be constructed within Praire Knoll Park in 2005. Praire Knoll Park is located at 2700 South Oakhill Avenue. Volunteers from the community are proposing to raise funds and develope this 18-acre, fenced in, off-leash facility. To help with this project contact Paw Print Park Fund, PO Box 2523 Janesville, WI 53547-2523."
This seems worthwhile. Not sure what the progess is on this however.

justsome1here -
WOW!! In a city of over 60,000 people - we have TWO places to take our dogs!!! WOW!!!!!
I'd be willing to bet that Afton Rd will be off limits soon too - it runs parallel to the new bike trails.

Why is the support so strong for the aquatics facility to be erected at Palmer Park? What are the alternatives and why is one better than the other? And should the city decide to reneg on their appropriation of land for a Pet Exercise and Training Area or should the people decide?

FYI: As stated on the City of Janesville web site "Treat your dog to exercise at the City's Pet Exercise and Training Areas, where you can exercise your dogs year-round without having to comply with the leash law. They are found in Palmer Park (between Palmer Drive, I-90 and Mohawk Drive) and along the Rock River Parkway (off Afton Road). Hours are daily from 5:00 a.m. to 11:00 p.m."

Palmer Park is not the only area in the city to exercise your pet.

Sweetie, we can only take our dogs elsewhere after Sept 15th until May 15th. There is a law stating no dogs can be in the parks during those summer months. The only place we DO have is the PETA that we can use at anytime.

if aquatic park does happen, it will need to be located right off I-90 to lure $$$$

The reason bikes are not allowed in the back trails at Palmer Park is that a few PEOPLE have been knocked over & injured by kids on bicycles. Someone I know was walking the trails when some kids came barreling around a corner & knocked her over. She ended up with a broken leg.

Let's see, on the one hand you have 5-9 million dollars to be made by various agencies, contractors, vendors etc. and on the other you have a few dogs.

Gosh, I wonder who's going to win this fight?

agreed, the city maintains the streets and parks -- and as a taxpaying citizen, i have no problem paying taxes for those services.
one proposal for the aquatic center is nearly 10 million dollars.
that's just to build it.
annual maintenance will be $400,000.
city mgr says approx 9,000 people will use it.
city mgr says the aquatic center needs to be affordable.
that means, the fee to get in will not cover the cost of maintenance.
not even close.
the role of government is to provide for my safety and provide for the public good.

my role as a citizen is to make sure they do.

an aquatic center, wherever it goes (and mike williams, leisure services director says palmer park is the best choice) is a poor business decision. these parks have failed time and again and each time they do, taxpayers get stuck with burden.

the reason savethedogpark.com was built was to give voice to the many people who otherwise would not be heard.
we will continue to speak out.

Ok is there no other place for dog owners to take their dogs? Theres not enough room for dogs to go somewhere and be walked or play with? I see people doing things with pets everywhere else? I think an aquatic center would be good for the community. Not just for the kids but for everyone. Why cant we welcome something new and give it a try? Maybe it doesnt have to be where the "dog park" is. However, honestly, you cant take your dogs anywhere else to play?! Im baffled.

I'm wondering why people are even worrying about this waterpark business when the city (or whoever) can't even raise money for the skate park (slated to be built next to the dog park) people so desperately clamored for "so the kids have something to do".

booch11-If you ride bikes on the paved bike trails in Janesville, some of the money for them came from the State of Wisconsin in the form of grants. They are also maintained by the City of Janesville as is the Dog Park. Not sure how the aquatics facility would be considered government assistance when the existing pool is not.

MIYATA
The Pet exercise area IS all of those trails off of palmer drive in the woods. In the open areas, it is part of the public park. But, yes..back where those old trails are..where people used to ride their bikes and make jumps and hills...is part of the dog park. The part that runs along the creek is part of the dog park. There is no cut off back in the woods on the trail. That is where the whole biking problem came from. I personally have no problem with bikes back there as my dogs are large enough and in control enough not to get in the way of others. Most people that ride back there still are aware of the dogs running around and do a good job of sharing.

AMBER
I think you misunderstood my post. I am totally for the waterpark. Like I said, I swim all year round and travel all year round to take kids to the waterparks. I would love to have something like that here in Janesville. I just don't think it needs to be where the dog park is. I think there are other options. I think Rockport should be turned into a waterpark similar to Fort Atkinson's or Edgerton's.

Bunyan, the whole back area ISNT part of the dog excercise area. The excercise area is about a quarter of the back area. The bike trails, well former trails, didnt even go in that area.

PLEASE do not take our park away!!!Janesville's kid's need Rockport Park revitalized. Gabby and her dog friends need a nice place to meet for playdates. The green grass is nicer and more comfy under their paws. Dogs do a great job for us when we are at work...they deserve a nicer park then that other place!!!!!

ok, we:
ride bikes;
take walks
go hiking
we golf
we spend time together
we visit relatives,
have block parties
we sit in the yard with neighbors,
oh, we walk the dogs
and guess what -- NONE OF THESE ACTIVITIES REQUIRE GOVERNMENT ASSISTANCE.
How is that possible amber?
you seem to need the city's help in having some good old fashioned fun.

I do recall saying I didnt care where the pool went rather it be rockport or palmer park. NOW I dont care if you can use a pool 78 days of the year or 365 my point was... what is there to do in Janesville, in the summer, with children, when its 95*? Now if you have some good ideas booch11, mustluvdogs, chafertepe, Seabee, vdelray, and bunyan732 I would love to hear them? Instead of flipping out over an aquatic center and saying we dont need it then lets discuss what YOU GUYS do with your kids that they have a lot of fun doing during the summer months? And if you can give me some REALLY good ideas maybe ill forget about the aquatic center!

MIYATA: I believe the reason they asked for bikes to not be allowed on the back trails is because it is a dog park. Those trails are part of the unleashed dog park. I am thinking that they didn't want any problems with dogs off the leash and bikers. It was probably a safety thought.

I am for the aquatic center. I travel with children multiple times during the week to swim in Whitewater, Fort, and Edgerton.

I believe it should be placed somewhere other than Palmer. We use that park for so many things and I don't understand why we need to demolish one great park in order to have another. It shouldn't even be an option. There should be better options for a location. I agree with all the talk about the Rockport location. Why would we create a new waterpark and then leave Rockport pool too? No one is going to use that anymore if there is a new waterpark. That location is already set for a pool.

We should not lose Palmer park due to the new pool. There is plenty of room for both!!

PLEASE DON'T TAKE AWAY MY DOGS PLAY AREA!!!!

Put it at Rockport. Tear the old pool down, remove the soccer fields (theres now plenty of them around town)and build the new facilities there.

BTW while we are at it, REMOVE THAT STUPID ORDINANCE BANNING BICYCLES FROM PALMER PARKS BACK TRAILS!!! THose trails have been used by bicycles for 30+ some odd years and NOW they decide that bicycles are prohibited there. Why? TO appease the 5 yuppies that walk the trails? Well if bicyclists cant use those trails, then pedestrians shouldnt be allowed to used the paved BICYCLE TRAILS around Janesville.

Why does the city keep talking about buying lots and demolishing buildings along the river to create "green space", and then consider turning a beautiful city park with plenty of Natural "green space" into a cement splash pad and aquatics facility? I say look at other options.

Oh Shucks...I typed up a long and positive response and it went "poof" in my system. So, I guess that is a sign for me to keep it short and sweet. booch 11: I certainly don't believe all children are causing trouble all summer long and I truly believe your child is walking your dog. I honestly just wanted to point out that we all enjoy different things in life, such as a good dog walking area and nice pools or what have you. So my point was...we should just respect these things instead of pulling people down. I used sarcasm in the previous post and I apologize. I always assume people get me when I type. LOL I guess not, but that's ok. It was brought up about the kids getting in trouble all summer long by the first person to post and was brought up by Seebea about the stop lights and the police. So I embellished and used sarcasm. I just see so many negative personal attacks on these forums and I can just see this one heading that direction. May your child enjoy walking the dog and using or not using the public water facility.

maresyann:
you said, "Each time something positive comes up for older children to do, it gets shut down. Why not find something for those kids so that they have less time to cause trouble and allow our police officers to help patrol the streets of those nasty people who run stop signs."

why do you assume all kids do is "cause trouble all summer long?"

(by the way, very few kids use the pool now -- do you really think an aquatic center will magically bring them in (especially the 'troublemakers?').
our city mgr sure doesn't think so.

and to your final comment to have "my kids walk the dog before going swimming...."

i have a 15 year old daughter. she walks the dog all the time. so, gladly!

and finally, i don't think any of the comments on this topic are negative. it's a healthy debate. that's what forums are for.

Although I feel that this readers comment area could be useful, I am frustrated by the negative use of this forum. Why aren't we helping to produce more positivity rather than insulting one another and tearing everyone down?
I have a dog. I don't use any of the dog facilities, but I can see how residents are fearful of having something disappear because it has become part of their life's routine. I don't care if this place doesn't exist, but others do. And maybe some would like the feeling of woodsy freedom rather than a chainlinked area (which I think is great too!)
I have children, but we rarely use the pools. If we do, we pay the daily fee and enjoy what we can. We frequently use the Edgerton pool due to it's extensive space and availability to several age groups. Who cares where such a facility is located in Janesville? It isn't like we live in Milwaukee and it would take forever to reach such a destination. And wouldn't we generate other revenue from out of city residents eager to use a state of the art facility?
We are also worried about this pool as being a place to "dump" our kids. Seriously, where do our kids get to go? We have wonderful parks for our young children, who are escourted by their parents or other responsible adults, but where do our adolescents go? Wouldn't a larger swimming facility keep them busy? Keep them from running around all summer without something to do? Each time something positive comes up for older children to do, it gets shut down. Why not find something for those kids so that they have less time to cause trouble and allow our police officers to help patrol the streets of those nasty people who run stop signs.
Booch11 wonders how children have survived all this time without a waterpark? Do you ever think that many children don't get to travel out of Janesville to such grand places with nice water facilities? Don't we want to provide them with positive memories so that they stay in Janesville and raise their own families here?
Hey..maybe you could ask your child to walk their dog at the dog park by Palmer Park before they get to go swimming at Janesville's new state of the art swimming facility with his/her friends?

If the water park is primarily intended to serve the people of Janesville, a more central location would make more sense. But do the people even want it? I bet a referendum would show that they don't.

Even if I don't currently own a dog, I do know many people who make use of the current facility. I wonder sometimes why the city wishes to constantly build more when we do already have existing structures that people can take advantage of during the summer months. Start using the money to clean up Rockport Pool and Lyons beach instead of destroying what few areas we people have to get away and relax in. Millions of dollars for maybe three months of use. What has the world come to?

Heres an idea. Instead of blowing 9 mil on more rec facilities than we need, how bout taking that cash and giving it to the teachers? And maybe they could hire some cops that actually give people tickets for runnung red lights in this town. its getting out of hand.

I dont think the aquatic center would be a dumping site for kids, I think it would be a great place to take kids and for families to have fun. I know Dawson's field is out but, that would be the perfect place, because it is already cemented over, its right in the middle of town (somewhat), and palmer and rockport could stay the way they are!!!!

What's selfish is tearing apart that natural space to cement over it so parents can have a place to dump their kids maybe three months out of the year. That land is more than a dog park to so many people. And in this day and age when global warming and living more earth friendly is all over the news does ripping up that green space seem like such a good idea? We only get one chance at land like that. Once it's gone it's gone.

and if i may add another comment, our city manager predicts only 9% of our population will use the aquatic center. quick math tells me that around 6,000 people.
many more than that use the pet exercise training area right now.
and, we use it all year long.
the city cannot afford this facility.
i wonder how kids survived without a water park for all these years?

i think amber should visit www.savethedogpark.com and check the facts. a park that close to the freeway presents a huge safety problem.
we have a pool. rockport park is a fine facility.
palmer is used by joggers, picnickers, frisbee football, lacrosse players, baseball players and many more people.
NOT JUST DOG OWNERS.
To put an aquatic facility on this location is actually the SELFISH DEED.
An aquatic center will be available for 78 days a year IF IT DOES NOT RAIN>
Amber, please check your priorities.

I think that if you are worried about your dog not having a place to run you should take your dog to the dog park on the south side of janesville. Our kids need something to do in the summer months when they are not in school. Although this is true :

Edwards and Michelle Scott, a dog groomer who also signed the petition, wonder why the city doesn’t repair and expand Rockport Pool on the west side.

“There’s room over there,” Scott said. “It doesn’t make sense. They started it over there.”
I dont care where an aquatics facility goes, we must admitt we DO need something for the kids. I think in this day and age we need to be worried about our children and what trouble they can get into in the summer, and not where our dogs can run.... thats selfish!