Midnight, so it's ok to attribute quotes to someone if you feel their actions say it? You can say that Hitler was against citizens owning firearms, but you can't put quotes on something unless you can prove he said it. It would set a real bad precedent if you can quote someone based on their actions. How would you react if someone made up a quote from Gov. Walker about public employees based on his actions? You would be upset if he didn't actually say it.

Slippery, we expect doctors to know about medicine too but, I wouldn't expect my family practice doctor to know all the ins and outs of brain surgery. If you want an analogy using the law, some attorneys work only in criminal law. You wouldn't want to hire one of them to read over your contract when you close on a house. The patrol officer "specializes" in general law much in the saw way the family practice doctor specializes in general medicine. He or she would be familiar with liquor license laws but would not know all of the requirements.

By your logic then accountants should not to need to know the tax laws like us. If you're a professional you have an obligation to know the ins and outs of your job including the laws.

"Police officers are not required to know the ins and outs of every law, they aren't lawyers. It's your civic duty to understand the laws."
.
A police officer is a citizen just like you and me, but its "my" civic duty to understand the laws more so than the police? I understand the point but most people expect the police to know the laws better than the average person.

kawisixer01
Dare accepted I bought my daughter her 410 pump at the Rock County gun show and no back ground check needed and walked away with it. The gentleman had several guns for sale, all rifles, along with many other items like gun straps, holsters, etc...etc...
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The Rock County gun show tables are not that expensive as you claim. I should know... friends of ours sell at this show,I also have seen the show advertisement for sellers and the booth space prices listed. You sure do talk a lot about stuff you know knothing about. Sure there may be some shows that the promoters require BC but none that I have ever been to.
*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEFEnzQ_... /
Above is a link to Sheriff Mack teaching a course on rights to citizens.. Rock County, we had a chance to elect a sheriff like this, and with the help of this paper's endorsement, we got spoden instead. yet Scot Angus claims his boss is a conservative? Really? I suspect that this paper, like the rest of the media, supports the agenda indicated by Mr. Rockefeller in this quote..

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time
Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended
our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost
forty years."

"It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world
if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those years.
But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a
world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite
and world bankers is surely preferable to the national
auto-determination practiced in past centuries."

by: David Rockefeller (1915- ) Internationalist billionaire, CFR kingpin, founder of the Trilateralist Commission, World Order Godfather
Date: June 1991 Baden, Germany
Source: Bilderberger Meeting, Baden, Germany

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEFEnzQ_... This is a video of Sheriff Mack.. Rock county could have elected a similar man in the form of Gary Keller, but did not. This paper endorsed Spoden. So, the next time Editor Scott Angus claims his boss, Mr. Bliss is a conservative, we'll know they're both liars.

received via email today..
Someone should be pointing out Robert Spoden on his Facebook page has "liked"
"Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik is a HERO" page, and

Clarence Dupnik is my Hero page

Dupnik is the one who helped divide the county after Rep Gifford shooting with a press conference given January 8 2011. Dupnik INCORRECTLY asserted that the vitriol of the right led to the violence in Tucson.

Does Spoden blame the right for gun violence ? And again, remember this paper endorsed Spoden for sheriff

It’s time to have a rational discussion about gun control without the paranoid delusions of people like Alex Jones and Midnight
"Their paranoid fear of a possible dystrophic future prevent us from addressing our actual dystrophic present. We can’t even begin to address 30,000 gun deaths that are actually in reality happening in this country every year because a few of us must remain vigilant against the rise of an imaginary Hitler”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlHP2xk8C...

kawisixer,
It used to be very easy to go to a gun show around here and buys guns cash & carry with no background check. The atmosphere changed fairly recently but not out of concerns for safety. The licensed dealers were upset with being undercut by people that would call themselves private sellers or collecters, set up a table and sell all day without background checks. The dealers got together with the show promoters and started creating rules that required private or collecter sales to be routed through the FFL dealers for a background check and a fee. They also began banning any private sales on or near the grounds of the gun shows to keep people from selling out of their vans in the parking lot. This was never about safety. This was about gun dealers seeing their profits cut into by the gun show loophole. Technically it's still legal for guns to be sold cash & carry/no background check at a WI gun show. Whether or not the promoters allow it is another story. You can go to numerous other states where guns shows are held without such restrictions.

Here we go again. The tin foil hat wearing Alex Jones disciples are comparing President Obama to Hitler. I'd laugh at the delusional ones if I didn't feel so sad for them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWdQe3UrR...

German women who survived the Nazis see all the similar history with Obama.

Another Benghazi Barry campaign statement issued to fool the uneducated voter.

You said yourself you can't prove he didn't say it. His actions would lead anyone to think he did.

September 5, 2008, 2:38 PM.
Obama: ‘I’m Not Going to Take Your Guns Away’.

Are they both liars or just one?

Midnight, so it's ok to quote a person if they didn't say something? It's make up facts to scare people. How many times has comparing someone or something to Hitler or Nazi's have won an argument? Never. I hear that someone once said that, should I make up someone to quote?

PanamaRed
Seems to me the tyrants are the ones with the guns.

15-Year-Old Defends Home Against Burglars, Shoots One Of Them With Father's AR-15
http://www.khou.com/news/crime/Burglary-...

such a tyrant.....

NRA: Guns Let Americans Take Care of Themselves, That's Why 'Elite Media' Hates Them

Liberals hate anything that allows individuals to care for themselves.

Walter -- nowhere in the 2nd ammendment nor the Bill of Rights do I find any statement that says sensible gun paws should be used to restrict gun ownership. If you reflect on the constitution and the BOR's -- the guns available to citizens at that time were the same guns used by the military-- law enforcement etc.. There was no break between the types nor quantity of guns allowed.

Given that -- regardless of some judges extension of interpretation -- which is guided by a predisposed opinion and emotion (in some cases), the reality is there are no specific nor intended restrictions, nor should there be. Any such restrictions have proven ineffective and I would argue that even Background checks are ineffective.

When people -- are unable to access basic mental health treatment or refuse such treatment, these said checks will not solve the problem nor will regulations -- without violating our constitution and our rights.

Walter: my point was that his mom purchased them legally and not from a gun show without a background check as everyone is starting to get up in arms about. Again eliminating guns shows would not have prevented him from taking his mothers legally purchased firearms and doing what he did. So why the focus and uproar??

I love the people trying to create the impression that these gun shows are just a bunch of private guys standing around selling guns to eachother without BG checks. Have you ever been to a gun show? Do you know the pricing of tables would snub out any person who isn't a busniess man with an FFL selling guns as an occupation? You can't buy guns from any wholesaler or manufacturer without an FFL. 99.9% of gun shows tables are bought and staffed by FFL holding business owners, the cost of doing it is prohibitive to anyone not in the business full time to be able to do it. These business owners cannot sell firearms without the 2 day wait and BG check, they would lose their FFL. I've been to a whole lot of gun shows and have yet to see someone walk up to a table and walk away with a gun without being forced to do the BG check and in the case of pistols waiting the 2 days. I dare any of you commenting otherwise to try and go purchase a gun at a show and prove me wrong. Now there is the rare instance where two collectors happen to meet at a show and make a sale, but that isn't any different than the guy advertising in this newspaper looking for a particular model of shotgun, or two co-workers making a deal to purchase/sell a rifle after work. The "gun show loop hole" is a madia/democrat sensationalized idea that in reality is an extremely rare event.

"Confiscating firearms has always been enforced before tyranny."
-
Seems to me the tyrants are the ones with the guns.

Wow!
That is breathtaking.

It doesn't have to be a "proven" quote when actions of dictators speak for itself.
The founding fathers knew throughout all of history free people must protect themselves when government begins to overreach. Thus, the 2nd Amendment
Confiscating firearms has always been enforced before tyranny.

Correct. Police officers are not required to know the ins and outs of every law, they aren't lawyers. It's your civic duty to understand the laws.

The owner is allowed to have his gun show....if he is willing to surrender his liquor license. He could have a gun show every week if he did that. Problem is that he violated the restrictions of a class b liquor license. He could be fined or possibly have the liquor license revoked. I'm just speculating but I doubt that the deputy that was called there is aware of all of the restrictions of a class B liquor license since they don't often do the inspections. When he got back to the office near the end of his shift, he discussed it with a supervisor who was aware of the restrictions. Again just speculation.

MIdnight, that is a popular Hitler quote...problem is there is no proof that he ever said it. http://www.newsday.com/opinion/viewsday-...

Midnight,
How is talking about enforcing a law regarding liquor licenses and gun shows the equivalent of dispossessing the citizenry of all firearms?
I realize that the NRA teaches its members to immediately accuse anyone who mentions sensible gun laws of demanding a ban on all guns. Are you a member? This imaginary binary choice of no gun laws at all or no guns at all is absurd and it's dying a quick death which I realize is quite scary for the NRA and other gun addicts. However, sensible conversations are starting and sensible reforms to gun laws will be proposed. The public supports it even if those that believe consuming alcohol at a gun show is Constitutionally protected do not.

Macdaddy,
The Newtown guns were stolen by the shooter from his mother. He didn't need to go to a gun show. However, allowing people to buy guns without a background check is just begging for convicted felons or unstable individuals planning a massacre to purchase guns. A background check and waiting period should apply to every gun sale period.

I bet there were a lot of off duty boys their from all over through out the weekend!

thanks, Kangaroo. it was very interesting to see the stories get moved, removed, and heaven only knows what all else.. I received an email stating that this whole thing probably involved the owner of a competing bar calling. Said owner's daddy is on the county board.. you get the idea.. who was the competing owner? whooooooo? whooooooooooooo

"To conquer a nation, first disarm its citizens" - Adolf Hitler

Hey Americans, don't baby out. Have the Gun Show.

Walter: the guns used in newtown were not bought illegally at a gun show as far as I am aware. So why stop something that had no bearing in this case and wouldn't have prevented the tragedy.

The surprising thing about this story is a Capt of the S.O. has never heard of this gun show for 18 years. It is posted yearly at major intersections throughout the county. One only needs to be observant when driving around the area. I bet the deputies he supervises all knew of this gun show this year and years past. He must have had to stay up late to make that 1201AM call, and on a wknd yet.

There are several issues at play here, and based on the readings the bar is in the wrong.

125.32(3m) LIMITATIONS ON OTHER BUSINESS; CLASS “B” PREMISES.
No Class “B” license or permit may be granted for any premises
where any other business is conducted in connection with the
premises, except that this restriction does not apply if the premises
for which the Class “B” license or permit is issued is connected to
premises where other business is conducted by a secondary doorway
that serves as a safety exit and is not the primary entrance to the Class “B” premises. No other business may be conducted on
premises operating under a Class “B” license or permit. These
restrictions do not apply to any of the following:
(a) A hotel.
(b) A restaurant, whether or not it is a part of or located in any
mercantile establishment.
(c) A combination grocery store and tavern.
(d) A combination sporting goods store and tavern in towns,
villages and 4th class cities.
(e) A combination novelty store and tavern.
(f) A bowling center or recreation premises.
(g) A club, society or lodge that has been in existence for 6
months or more prior to the date of filing application for the Class
“B” license or permit.
(h) A movie theater.

This explains why hotels with bars can host gun shows and the like, they are exempted by statute.

The second problem is that the "Old Red Barn" is Gene O's Bar, and there are fully stocked bars in both sides of the building. If the alcohol was only sold in one side of the building and the second side was entirely used for non-bar activity the owner would be correct. However, based on the reading of the statute, I have to side with the Sheriff.

In reference to the show being there in years past I can only assume that either A. There were no problems at the bar so it did not come to anyone's attention, or B. The banquet hall area did not have a bar set up, at which point it would be legal.

my $0.02

Macdaddy,
I would say that perhaps there have been numerous cases of law enforcement simply looking the other way or not being knowledgable of the types of liquor licenses held by the facilities where the gun shows were being held. Perhaps, the facilities fully secure the alcohol during the time that the gun shows are being held and, in doing so, are found to be in compliance with the law.
What I can say now, and thank God I can say this, is that gun shows may now be under much more scrutiny in the wake of the Newtown massacre. As gun sales with no background check occur most frequently at gun shows, I think it's best for everyone's safety if the show promoter, the facility hosting the show and all the exhibitors are required to operate to the letter of the law at all times while the gun show is taking place.

What I can't understand is that almost all of these convention centers have a liquor license where all these shows happen so why is this different?? Also have you ever seen how much drinking goes on at a NRA banquet or other wildlife sponsored banquets?? And yet there are guns raffled off, auctioned off etc. no problems there and there was a booze a flowing. In fact many organizers were buying because they said to me that people spend more when they've had a few drinks in them.

I hope he sues the p*** out of them.

Maxcap- Relax. You are not entire right either, not everyone that attends a gun show is a CCW permit holder. For those that are not.

941.237(2) "Whoever intentionally goes armed with a handgun on any premises for which a Class "B" or "Class B" license or permit has been issued under ch. 125 is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor."

wow!!!!! the misinformation coming from both sides of this argument is simply astounding!!! If you don't know what you are talking about then shut up!!!! you just make it harder for people to know the truth from the lies/inaccuracy's!!!! #1-It is completely LEGAL to carry a concealed carry gun into a bar!! or on the premises of a liquor license holder! Gun shows happen in hotel banquet halls all over this country!!!! You are not allowed to drink with said CCW though. Once you start to consume alcohol you are in violation of the law. #2-WI. has a 2 day (48 hour) waiting period, not a 3 day waiting period. Come on people, get the facts straight or stay out of the conversation.

FYI-it is illegal for law enforcement to release the name of someone that wants to be anonymous "Monfils Law"

Back ground checks are required for all gun sale being done by all gun dealers. A three day waiting period is required on all handguns bought. If I remember right the waiting period law was passed mainly because of some act done that was all over the media just like what is going on now. I can remember when it happened but can't remember all the facts but it has the same felling as it does now...Wake up people they are taking are rights a piece at a time!

If you violated the law then have to face the consequences. If you think the law should be changed take it up with lawmakers in Madison not the sheriff's department.I think the argument that this went on for 40 years without a problem is like me saying i drove over the speed limit for 40 years so when i get a ticket i should be able to get out of it because i have done it for so long.

Patriot, sorry, but you are misinformed. A legal CCW permit holder can carry a concealed weapon in a tavern, however if you are drinking alchohol, then it is against the law to be in posession of any firearm. Something is strange when a gun show gets shut down after succesfuly operating for 40 years.

Honorfirst,
So now it's a "right" to attend gun shows where alcohol is being served? In which Constitiutional Amendment would I find the "right" to keep, bear, sell & trade arms at an establishment where alcohol is being consumed?

Is it possible through open records to find out who reported this "tip"? I would think the person should have enough backbone to stand in front of his/her fellow citizens and proclaim they did the right thing by calling the Sheriff's dept. I am betting they are another "closet" liberal that would like to take this right away from law abiding citizens.

I sympathize with the business owners for what happened.

I had intended to go to the show on Sunday but when I arrived there was a sign stating it had been cancelled.

I understand there is a precedent here but I also know there is a law stating no one is allowed to carry a firearm into a building that has a liquor license .

Perhaps the answer will be to lock all alcohol in a safe and serve only sodas that day?

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. We must be certain ALL state businesses obey state and federal laws. But in this case the business was on the level, did not attempt to hide anything and has been doing the shows for many years.

The anonymous phone call is suspicious. Hopefully the police have record of the phone number and the public will eventually have access to it.

If state law was violated, I doubt any money will be awarded in law suits. I suspect the amount in question is actually low enough to end up on small claims court if there is an issue between the show sponsor and the owner of the building.

At any rate, the phone call ruined the day for a lot of people.

By the way, background checks were being done there on Friday when I first visited.

Yes, there may be the statute and its interpretation, but isn't the major, root issue here the Sheriff's Office itself? There's a multiple-date gathering of 10,000 people with guns and booze in their county and they have not heard about it for at least 18 years???

The first Sheriff their was conducting an investigation in a public place . He reported what he seen to his supervisor what he seen , supervisor put that together with the call in complaint and it was cancelled . Wonder who made the complaint ?

I hope he files the law suit and i hope he wins it , It seems this is the only way to change .

http://www.independent.com/news/2013/jan...

I agree with this business owner. It would have been better to allow the event to continue, then speak with the facilitator afterwards to have it discussed and fixed if needed for the next such event.
*
Gun-control is not at issue here.

Waiting period is just for handguns. I purchased an AR15 a couple years ago and walked out of the store with it the same day.
-
See they already recognize that crazy people are more likely to buy a handgun so that they have a waiting period on. So why they are not trying to ban hanguns instead of assault rifles is beyond me.?? Its funny that just because of the name "assault" people fear and want to ban it.

Lumberjack, I am also a hunter, CCW license holder and I also agree background checks should be done at retail and gun shows. If people are the problem then lets do our part in helping to keep guns out of their hands. Along with that would the irresponsible gun owners please stop leaving you guns unattended in the car and house (theft is how many guns get in the hands of criminals).

Maxcap75....from the article "Heiman said alcohol was served at the gun show, but IDs were checked"

well said MAXCAP. cynical, background checks are part of the deal. i believe that they only apply to handguns. Myself being a hunter, and a gun enthusiast believe that the background check should be required on all firearms retail purchases. It is the least we can do to protect our communities as well as our rights.

cynicaleye, you can buy all the guns you want without a background check, all you have to be is a non-felon, and buy from a private person from your own state. If you buy from a dealer or from someone from another state, you need to go through the required background checks and wait the 2 day waiting period. Simple as that. I would expect with all this unwarranted hysteria though, that the private sales will come to an end soon though.

How many Damn times does it need to be said!?!?!?!?!?!?! There is NO alcohol served at gun shows!!!!! I have been going to gun shows practically every weekend of my adult life and have not once seen alcohol or a an intoxicated person!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Why will people just plain not listen? They just hear what they want to hear, if they have their mind set that they hate guns, they will say anything to forward their agenda. I am a non-drinker and would be the first person to bring an alcohol situation to an officer on the premises! Just open up your minds just a little.

What happened to my right to buy as many guns as I want without a background check?

How can he not know about previous ones? There is a huge sign out front that says "GUN SHOW" and the date. I guess Evansville is too big of a town.

BTW Patriotsal, your other posts are in the same story here in the blog section. Why the Gazette has TWO stories exactly the same floating around I havent the clue.

why isnt the law enforced at the holiday inn and other places that do the same thing, with a class b liquor license?

Did the Sheriff shut down the show?

Ignorant people are scared people. And fear drives people to do stupid things.

Some people are so ignorant,the bar is on one side of the wall & the hall is on the other side,it is not like people getting a beer in hand and bidding on guns,gawd some people are just dumb thinking !!

patriotsal
The comments are in the previous article. Easiest way to check them is to enter your user Id into the gazetts search box and it will pull up your account from there you can go to previos articles you posted on.

why were all the previous comments cleared? or are they somewhere else?

The only thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun who's drinking is a good guy with a gun who's drinking...thats the logic?

Good luck Limits are posted for a reason and Alcohol and guns do not make for a good thing. The Red Barn use to be a great place for Family Functions and dances.