Downtown Janesville parking plaza's days are numbered
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The downtown Janesville Parking Plaza that is built over the Rock River.
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The parking plaza has nearly 300 parking places and has been a part of downtown Janesville since 1963.
JANESVILLE — It's no longer a question of if the parking plaza in downtown Janesville will be removed.
It's only a matter of when.
City officials and downtown businesses are working to reshape the discussion into one about a downtown that incorporates the Rock River rather than turning its back to the waterway.
"We've moved beyond the discussion and debate about whether the parking plaza should be removed," said Duane Cherek, Janesville's manager of planning services. "We've reached a new level where the discussion is, 'What do we want to do?'
"This has the potential to be a game changer for downtown Janesville. We have the opportunity to create a focal point for activity that really becomes a destination."
The parking deck was built in 1963 over the Rock River between Milwaukee and Court streets. Two years later, a second section was added closer to Court Street.
The plaza has become a focal point that's provided convenient downtown parking for nearly five decades.
But philosophies have changed.
Conventional wisdom now holds that a massive slab of concrete over a waterway is not a good idea, from neither environmental nor aesthetic perspectives.
"It used to be that a river was not considered an asset to the community," said Carl Weber, Janesville's public works director. "In the 1950s and '60s, they were considered open sores, the back door of the community.
"That attitude has changed, and they are now considered a major asset."
As downtown Janesville declined, study after study said the parking plaza must be sacrificed in the name of economic revitalization.
Not surprisingly, the idea met with resistance from downtown businesses who enjoyed the convenience of the parking deck for customers and employees.
Now, however, the state Department of Natural Resources is forcing the issue. It's told the city that it can do minimal maintenance on the deck, but it can't do anything to extend its life.
Studies indicate that the deck has five to 10 years left before it must be removed, Weber said.
Out in front
With the inevitable looming, Weber decided to start the discussion: What does the community want its downtown to look like once the parking deck is removed?
The city met with Forward Janesville and the Downtown Development Alliance, a group of downtown business owners that has traditionally favored the parking deck.
Dave Marshick, chairman of the downtown alliance, said his group has in turn met with downtown business owners, particularly those closest to the plaza.
"The sense we got was not, 'Oh my God! What are we going to do?'" Marshick said. "It was more like, 'This is going to happen, so let's do it right.'
"There's a sense that this can become a real positive for the downtown."
The parking plaza—historically the city's best-used parking structure—has about 285 parking spaces. About one-third of them are not over the river, Weber said.
Occupancy ranged from 82 percent in 2006 to 59 percent in 2011, he said, noting that the occupancy rate of all of the downtown parking areas was 37 percent last year.
Removing the deck, he said, would force the city to redirect parking to other areas.
Many of those spaces, he said, can be found in other city lots and the new parking ramp on Parker Drive.
"We have underutilized spaces," Weber said, noting that the top level of the new garage has been closed the last two winters because it isn't being used.
"We can make better use of our existing parking areas."
Weber said a compromise would keep some of the parking along the edges of the current deck while still making it available on an as-needed basis for special public uses.
Weber said it would be possible to retain some of the plaza's parking that is not over the river. Parking in those spaces, he said, could be prohibited when they're needed for public events or celebrations.
Marshick said the loss of parking has been the primary concern of downtown businesses. So, too, has been service access to the rear of businesses in the first block of South Main Street.
He agrees that parking is available in other areas, and it's not far away from the central downtown. He said the biggest struggle in convincing people to use it, however, is human nature: Closer is better.
Early ideas
A proactive approach to the removal of the parking plaza carries two benefits, Weber said.
First, it would allow the stakeholders to work together to come up with a redevelopment plan that addresses parking and provides the best public use of riverfront property.
Second, it would allow the city to apply for grants to help pay for the deck's removal and redevelopment of the area.
"If we took the plaza out tomorrow, we would have to pay for it all," Weber said, noting that the cost to remove a similar parking deck in Beloit cost more than $2 million.
A central theme, he said, would be to transform riverfront property into appealing places that make the downtown a destination.
"We'd like to make it a place where people want to live, work and play," he said.
Weber draws on his experience in Green Bay and its "City Deck," a public-private project designed to bring people in touch with the Fox River through boat docks, pedestrian walks, open spaces and stage areas.
"It's become the community's front porch," he said. "It's created all sorts of new opportunities downtown."
Weber said early discussions would help formulate a plan that could be supported in part by grants.
"There's not one program to cover it all," he said. "I foresee us agreeing on what we want to do about removing the plaza and reengineering the parking and then going to agencies to see if there's a piece that fits their program.
"Maybe it's something for business development, maybe there's something for riverfront redevelopment."
In Green Bay, the City Deck project layered seven or eight grants to offset costs, he said.
What's next?
Weber and Cherek said they would approach the city council this spring with some preliminary thoughts on the removal of the plaza and redevelopment opportunities.
At this point, the plan is to retain parking in nearby areas on both sides of the river and investigate any other replacement parking that's needed.
Once the deck is removed, walkways and bikeways adjacent to the river would be enhanced, and a pedestrian bridge could cross the river.
Cherek said the Plaza Furniture building on River Street presents an opportunity for redevelopment as well. It is going out of business.
Staff will continue to get public ideas for ways to enhance enjoyment of the river and promote business and housing development opportunities.
"The whole idea is to get out in front of this and do so creatively," Weber said.
Fighting the DNR to rebuild the plaza would be futile, he said.
"We can probably get help from state and federal agencies in coming up with a solution to open the river back up, but we aren't going to get any money to replace it.
"This shouldn't be a funeral for the plaza. It's an opportunity for a new birth."
'The process is off to an excellent start'
As an owner of a downtown business that depends on Janesville's parking plaza, Jackie Wood is torn about the structure's future.
She sees the long-term benefits of removing of the parking plaza, but the potential for short-term problems weighs heavily on her mind.
"While I have my personal feelings about it, I have to think about my tenants," said Wood, an owner of the Olde Towne Mall on South Main Street.
"I've surveyed my tenants, and most said that if that parking can be replaced conveniently, they don't have a problem with it."
But if the replacement parking is not convenient, they'd probably move, she said, acknowledging that opinions differ on the definition of convenience.
In any parking plaza discussion, Wood remembers the position of Terry Campbell, her longtime friend and fellow downtown businessman. Before he died in 2008, Campbell renovated the old Woolworth's building into the Riverfront Center and was a champion for downtown revitalization.
"He would say that we all need to band together and oppose any effort to remove the deck, even if we had to chain ourselves to it," Wood said. "But now I sense a switch in perspective, a reality check."
That reality check comes from the state Department of Natural Resources, which has said the city is cannot do anything to extend the life of the parking plaza. It likely will be removed in the next five to 10 years.
Wood said she's thrilled the city is taking a proactive approach to the deck's removal. Opening up the river, she said, presents opportunities for an upscale redevelopment that would bring more people downtown.
"I really like what the city is doing, and (City Manager) Eric Levitt has put together a great staff," she said. "They're willing to listen to us—actually come to us and listen—before they start a plan.
"The idea is that we can go forward together. The process is off to an excellent start, and everyone working together is the key to the whole thing."
Mark Groshan owns the Janesville Athletic Center Express in the building that is owned by Carol Campbell, Terry's wife.
Groshan said finding reasonable replacement parking for his customers would be critical to him staying in business in downtown Janesville.
A large percentage of his downtown members use the parking plaza, and replacement parking across the street likely would present safety issues that he doesn't think his customers want to address.
One option that might work, he said, would be replacement parking at the current site of Plaza Furniture, which is going out of business. City officials said they are looking at the property as part of their riverfront acquisition plans.
Carol Campbell said parking for her tenants and their customers is paramount. She said it's difficult to discuss leases with tenants or potential renters when the only virtual certainty is that parking for a couple hundred vehicles is going to be relocated to points unknown.
"The city is going to have to look at alternatives, and I'm not sure a single street lot is going to do it," she said. "The city is probably going to have to buy land.
"It's a very big deal not to have adequate parking down there."
That said, Campbell said it's important for downtown businesses and their customers to expect a certain amount of walking.
"You go to any downtown, and people have to walk to their destinations," she said. "There's a certain joy in being in a downtown, and to a certain extent you just have to accept that walking is a part of it."
Feb 27, 2012 at 5:20 p.m.
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Just imagine if just north of the parking plaza was covered too, all the businesses that wouldnt be there. I bet the all benefit greatly because of the uncovered river. I bet all the bars would be dead if there was additional parking and a covered river.
Feb 27, 2012 at 3:20 p.m.
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mcs, you ask a question without an easy answer. Many urban planning standards of the 1950s through today favored sprawl development and used various formulas for necessary parking. This created a vicious circle of making cars a requirement -- you can't walk from store to store -- and needing adequate parking at EACH property for its maximum car count. Downtown parking, on the street as well as public structures, was intended to be shared and in many ways shifted the costs of a car-oriented culture onto taxpayers, especially as the downtown businesses found it more difficult to compete against the sprawl development. The answer is not to debate who should pay, but how to develop so that the costs and benefits are shared more fairly. Today, we have an assumption that even downtown businesses should have "enough" parking for themselves, but creating more private or public parking (and razing buildings to do it) reduces the density of the downtown, eliminates the ability of the city to collect property taxes, and paradoxically creates a greater need for parking because it is no longer possible to park one place and visit three. It's an awful way to plan, and this sounds like the first step in getting off that merry-go-round.
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As with SHINE, this is a tremendous opportunity for Janesville going forward, and I hope we're ready to take it.
Feb 27, 2012 at 2:05 p.m.
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Removing the parking ramp to restore the natural beauty of the river is a step in the right direction. Now they just to remove the REST of the human-erected structures in Janesville to finish the job that GM started.
Feb 27, 2012 at 1:18 p.m.
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Whatever will the carp do for shade now.
Feb 27, 2012 at 12:52 p.m.
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I can't believe I'm actually saying this, but I'm not sure taking out the parking plaza would help stimulate any downtown revival. I believe areas immediately adjacent to the river would still be in a flood zone, correct? Realistically, how much commercial activity could we expect to return to the downtown with this relatively small length of the Rock River uncovered? Would it REALLY make a difference? -- I would agree that it was originally not a good idea based on today's standards and values. Although it may improve the aesthetics of downtown, I doubt that it would improve the economic situation. It would definitely be a feel-good thing, but would not necessarily pay for itself.
Feb 27, 2012 at 12:07 p.m.
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The biggest problem with down town is there is no problem. We have to remember it was all built and designed to accomodate far less of a population. WalMarts , malls, Woodmans didnt exist. These were buildings built to house shops that serviced most of rock county. Milton Ave has since taken over due to the growth of the city. Its pure lunacy to expect down town to compete with Milton ave or be even close. Its days of being the number one area are long gone...just like the rotary phone. It serves the smaller specialty shops just fine, and the few people who seek those shops have no problem finding them. People need to quit grasping for reasons and just accept down town for what it is. Nothing wrong with it.
Feb 27, 2012 at 10:39 a.m.
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li713 - all I can say is AMEN. Your post summed up the mindset of Janesville - sad, but so very true.
Feb 27, 2012 at 10:35 a.m.
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I don't think river front condos would be a bad thing if there were demand for them. Nothing would get downtown up and going like more people actually living there.
Feb 27, 2012 at 10:16 a.m.
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I have a question that I would like answered and I would really like something other than "well that's the way it is". Why is it that if you have a business anywhere outside the downtown area you need to purchase and maintain space for parking ? If you have a business in the downtown area that all falls onto the taxpayer.
Feb 27, 2012 at 9:39 a.m.
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Anyone besides me thinking it's more then just getting rid of the parking slab???
Maybe there is a hidden agenda,like people that own the land & buildings around there,condo ever crossed anyone's mind,water front condo's???
These people are sneaky in putting up diversions in this city,anything is possible,they think they are so smart,and were so dumb!!
Feb 27, 2012 at 9:25 a.m.
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Because the parking deck is built over the river, the DNR regulates. They also regulate the bridges, etc. that involve waterways.
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I'm happy to see that Janesville finally thinks it's a good idea to talk about something and do some planning BEFORE it becomes a necessity, but I think that 10 years out is a little too far. Given the economic situation now, I really hope that things will be entirely different in 10 years. It seems preemptive to get too far into planning for something that may be entirely different 10 years from now. I know the majority of people that comment on the Gazette articles seem to think that the downtown is entirely dead and we should just bulldoze it, run high speed limit streets thought it to speed up the drive from one side of town to the other, and forget it all ever existed, but I've been downtown quite a bit in the last few months and I see something entirely different. Sure there are bars on Main Street, but you can also get an excellent meal at a number of places downtown. Last week we went to O'Reily and Conways for their Mardi Gras menu and it was fantastic. On the way (since we had to park a WHOLE block away) I noticed a new ladies clothing shop that wasn't there the last time we walked that way to visit the Cozy Inn. I have a number of friends that regularly attend Thursday comedy nights at the Armory. Ells Bells boutique is a neat store that just popped up in the last 6 months. I also noticed a new spa near Milwaukee Street and Main Street the other day while driving by. There is more downtown than bars and pawn shops, and the new things that seem to have come out of nowhere in the last 6 months has me hopeful that things will continue to improve downtown. I can't wait for the farmer's market to get going again, and hopefully it will really help these new businesses if they can make it that long.
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The biggest problem for our downtown is the people of this city. We drive right through without ever stopping or god forbid slowing down and looking to see what's new because we see what we want to see and anything that doesn't fit our skewed preconception either doesn't exist or is worthless in our eyes. If we don't personally use it, then obviously NOBODY uses it. We will complain endlessly about parking down the street or around the corner, even if it is actually a closer distance than you can get at Wal-Mart or the Mall. We refuse to try anything new, and usually will also complain endlessly about that as well. We are our own worst enemy and complain about everything, but at the end of the day we have no one to blame but ourselves.
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On a side note, I've lived here my whole life and it makes me a little sad to think of that parking deck being gone. I have lots of good childhood memories of Woolworth's and that area of downtown. I hope that the city can figure out how to make something good out of it again.
Feb 27, 2012 at 9:12 a.m.
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The old Plaza furniture would be a great spot for a new parking ramp. The building is ugly and no historic value.
It seems there is plenty of parking downtown. We have a new ranm that I have never even been past the first row in. People are such lazy buts here. If they cannot hop out of the car door and onto the front porch of the business they say " there isn't any parking". Go to Chicago or Madison. If you get on the same block you are lucky and then you are 4-8 levels from the street besides.
The DNR is involved because if that lot lands in the RIVER that isn't good.
Again I see no reason to put in another ramp at all if places are not open for us to SHOP. Go down on a Sunday and it is a ghost town. WE CANNOT SHOP IF YOU ARE NOT OPEN. Nothing after 5 and nothing on Sunday!!!
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Free shuttle running around the downtown area for the users. Something for the visitors as well as the citizens of Janesville."
WALK!- you can walk the WHOLE downtown from one end to the other and not even get winded. It ISN'T CHICAGO!
The call it the Mag Mile- yep because it is only 1 mile long TOTAL.
truth1- noise???
Doc"Cherek said the Plaza Furniture building on River Street presents an opportunity for redevelopment as well. It is going out of business."
True I saw that too. They shut down a bit ago. Guess the didn't hire somebody to do the research(read the paper!!)
Feb 27, 2012 at 8:29 a.m.
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"They paved paradise to put up a parking lot." Joni Mitchell
Feb 27, 2012 at 8:20 a.m.
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Can anyone shed some light on why the DNR is involved in this decision, and why they are saying the parking deck needs to come down? Is it a safety issue or a river / ecology related issue?
Feb 27, 2012 at 7:04 a.m.
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Considering that currently we have the biweekly need to go downtown when we haven't had to in years, we see firsthand that this ramp can be quite full. The one question that I have did not seem to have a clear answer in this article, so maybe it hasn't been formulated: how are you going to replace all the spaces? Circumstances dictate that, no, we cannot walk for 3-4 blocks from a parking ramp to our destination. The ramp provides for parking maybe 50-100 feet away from the door.
Feb 27, 2012 at 6:58 a.m.
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I have to say downtown Beloit looks better since our deck was removed, the city added a canoe launch and attractive stonework along the banks. Beloit received some grant money, I believe, to help with removal costs. Give this a chance; with the time span Janesville has to work with, they can deal with the parking issues and make this a showpiece for downtown.
Feb 27, 2012 at 6:28 a.m.
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The downtown is not going to "flourish" with or without a parking ramp over the river. If the ramp has "5 or 10" more years then tear it out in 5 or 10 years and quit fretting about it now because No other parking needs to be created. There is plenty of parking space to make up for the ramp. If the spa customers have to walk a block or two more to park, the extra exercise will do them good.
Feb 27, 2012 at 5:31 a.m.
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What the heck does the DNR have to do with a parking lot? I know it's next to the river but so what? Also Naperville, IL has a great area in their downtown called River Walk and it draws a lot of people. Maybe Janesville should take a look at that project to see if it's viable for Janesville.
Feb 26, 2012 at 11:47 p.m.
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I think if you really want business to flourish in a downtown area you have to have decent housing for younger people just starting out in life and retired people who have more expendable income to spend at locally owned or specialty shops/restaurants. I am pretty sure that is lacking in downtown Janesville
Feb 26, 2012 at 8:52 p.m.
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What about a farmers market or city wide garage sale on weekends where vendors could rent a parking space to sell stuff?
Feb 26, 2012 at 8:12 p.m.
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Sigma, I was thinking that same thing, do businesses in the next block between Milwaukee St. and Centerway do more business without that parking plaza behind their businesses? And you know the rest of what you say will end up happening, Janesville will hire an outside firm to do a study as to where to get more parking from. I sure would like it if The Gazette could do a little research as to how much the city has spent in the past twenty years just in consulting fees associated with downtown studies, I wouldn't think it would be hard for someone down at the paper to figure that out with all of the studies that have been published, it would be the ones we aren't told about that could add up to mind blowing figures.
Feb 26, 2012 at 8:11 p.m.
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"What asset is the river there?"
I guess if you have to be told, it is not really worth the effort.
Feb 26, 2012 at 8:07 p.m.
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Cherek said the Plaza Furniture building on River Street presents an opportunity for redevelopment as well. It is going out of business.
Huh???
Plaza Furniture closed at the end of December, and after checking into it I found out that the City of Janesville had given that property to its owner, now that Mr. Siker has closed that store shouldn't the city get that parcel of land back from him since he will no longer be using it, and if so maybe they could sell it and use some of that money (ALL OF IT) to help pay for this pet project?? And further more can they pick one or the other, one way street conversion to two way, or this new project?
News flash for the people that work for the city that are coming up with these projects, WE ARE STILL BROKE!!!! Where is the money going to come from for this one, and before anyone says mainly from grant money, I really feel the need to point out that Government grant money is TAXPAYER MONEY! Believe it or not, the Government doesn't have a magical money tree, even if they do act like they do, that money comes from all of us in the form of taxes, ad it's projects like this that makes our country go further into debt!
Feb 26, 2012 at 8:04 p.m.
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So we want more people to come downtown so removing parking will inspire that? Then if more people come where are they going to park. We'll end up spending $500k on a consulting firm to tell us we need more parking. What asset is the river there? Its a body of water flowing through 2 concrete walls.
Feb 26, 2012 at 7:47 p.m.
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Cant people walk anymore i live on the hill an walk downtown all the time and shop. I wouldn't know what to do if that ugly parking deck was removed and I walked down and seen a river. Being a huge critic of the city government this is the first thing that makes sense to do. I would pay more in taxes too see that ugly deck gone. Truth most humans evolve to change those who don't die or live under the parking deck I think your the later soon to be the former. Love Janesville the city that fights culture at all costs
Feb 26, 2012 at 6:54 p.m.
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It sounds good, get that parking lot off of the river and use the river as an asset. This is the way it is going in several cities around the State. The ramp has reached its life span according to the experts, so now is the time to remove it. This ramp was built in 1963 when parking downtown was at a premium, now downtown parking is less in demand, obviously due to the buildup of outer areas and malls, etc.
Feb 26, 2012 at 6:34 p.m.
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I'm hopeful for a vibrant downtown and am in favor of development that would result in such results. I am so sick and tired of the bland strip malls such as the Pinetree Plaza and the whole Wal-mart area. They make shopping a chore and not a pleasure! But right now, there is very little that makes me want or need to come downtown. We rode our bikes on the trail to downtown to watch the parade last fall; that was neat. Then there were the floods a few years ago. It was fun to go downtown to watch the fish come skidding down Main Street! We occasionally hit the restaurants and pubs downtown, but other than that, I don't recall the last time we spent any money downtown. And that, of course, is what's really needed. A nice downtown that would lure businesses to locate there that we would all want to visit. Removing the parking deck may very well make the area more appealing to visit. I could see a nice cafe or restaurant overlooking the river. Maybe a book/coffee store again? I'd like to start shopping down there again.
Feb 26, 2012 at 6:01 p.m.
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Change is sometimes a good thing if we want the downtown to flourish we need to make it attractive.what about over the road walkways, or at least flashlights in the road to alert to pedestrians like they have in the Dells. Free shuttle running around the downtown area for the users. Something for the visitors as well as the citizens of Janesville.
Feb 26, 2012 at 5:51 p.m.
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Really? there are people that think this parking platform over the river is a problem? Get these idiots out of power, we dont need people inventing problems so they fix them and look good. I doubt anyone in that area cares whether the river is covered up or not. And im sure someones friend is standing by waiting to collect the 3+ million dollars they are going to get for removing it. Obviously the people who decide about this stuff have no clue, the knocked down a perfectly good parking ramp behind quotes a couple years ago to build a parking lot, then it wasnt enough so they built another parking ramp....Idiotic logic at its finest.. but someone made money off it.
Feb 26, 2012 at 5:35 p.m.
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"Culture"???
I like culture, I even kind of like motorcycles, but its the law as well as courtesy and sense that they have mufflers.
I do not go where I have to be assaulted by ear-splitting, ILLEGAL racket and no effort is put into stopping it.
Feb 26, 2012 at 5:07 p.m.
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No G.M.,no parking ramp,no one way streets to race from stop sign to stop sign,no Woolworth,no tishes pool hall,fannie mays,no town tap,no myers,no jeffers,many many more things gone,my home town,bull,just take all the land marks away,maybe people on the hill could rename the town,maybe,B-Janes,or loitville.
Next after the ramp is gone,the city will want more money from tax payers to build more parking,just don't get it,they already tore down one perfectly good parking ramp,then spent our money building another,HMMMM !!
Feb 26, 2012 at 4:51 p.m.
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Really? With all the traffic on milton ave there's tons off noise downtown? I live close by and I don't see it. But go to milton ave on a Friday, Saturday nite and see what's up. lol.
Feb 26, 2012 at 4:37 p.m.
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truth1>yea loud pipes is why I consume fastfood aswell, thank god there is no culture in Janesville
Feb 26, 2012 at 4:30 p.m.
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truth... loud Harleys?
Feb 26, 2012 at 4:11 p.m.
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I used to like going to downtowns when noise laws were enforced.
Nowdays I can't go to any downtown without being assaulted by massive noise from illegal exhaust pipes.
Now its walmart and the other food joints for me, no more downtowns if I have to put up with that.
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