Fences might put an obstacle in front of little Jonny/Janie, but rest assured they prevent nothing. Kids are ingenious, & by blocking their way your only encouraging them to use their ingenuity. I once that by putting the medicine up on top of our 6+Ft high refrigerator would be a safe place, so that our 14mth old couldn't get to it. I thank God everyday I got up early one morning as my 14mth had pulled up a chair, & put a box on it, & was just reaching up to pull off the med box off the fridge. If you have little kids, & meds in the house lock em up. As for this fence.. STUPID WASTE OF TIME & Taxpayer money wasting the time on the Ord. anyone who thinks regulating behaviors is a good thing.. I know I waste time & finger energy typing this.. but "you people haven't learned anything from history." Rhetorical Questions.. How are those drinking & driving laws going? Has it stopped people from doing it? How about those speeding ordinances? Have they stopped the speeding through residential neighborhoods? & what about under-aged drinking laws? Hey.. & what about those pesky nuisance neighbors next door. Are they gone because you know we spent a whole bunch of money drafting, & then passing that nuisance neighbor ordinance. And what about that law that requires sex offenders to stay away from our little ones? None of these work.. for sure that nuisance neighbor ordinance.. EDUCATION Works... You can Ordinance us to the grave, but in truth all they're really doing is raising our taxes by creating Government Fee's (i.e. speeding tickets, building permits for fences, Inspections, etc).. The only one that cares about my safety & yours.. is me, & my loved ones. The government cares only about creating revenue so they can waste it.

Shopierehuh - Well those that do remove their ladders should not be punished for those too lazy to remove theirs!

We live outside of the city of Janesville and have a permanent above-ground pool. The ordinence is that we have to have a ladder which the stairs flip up, or a fence. (We have the ladder). Yes, some 1 year olds are capable of climbing a ladder when the stairs are down. If a small child could get into our pool with how it is set up, they could easily get over a 4 foot fence too. Our neighbors have a pool similar to the one in the picture. They remove their ladder from the pool when not in use. It is called responsibility. If you are too busy, or too distracted, to own a pool and practice safe habits.....don't get a pool! If you have to have the pool, practice safely and get a flip up ladder or a removable one. If a homeowner doesn't comply then maybe they should be fined.

frogger, I had a mom ask me the exact same thing, the fourth time I called her to come and get her two kids (ages 4 and 2) out of my yard. She was offended that SHE was expected to watch them all the time. I lived a block & a half away too - no way she could have seen them or known what they were up to.

I hear what you are saying, DT. But does anyone seriously think that the ladders will be taken out of the pool? Mostly, they won't. What size child can put the ladder back in? I'm guessing a 5 year old could.

Shopierehuh - I believe the ladder you are referring to is supposed to be taken out of the pool when it is not in use. That way a 1 - 4 year-old can't get into the pool! This is why I always assumed those types of pools were not subjected to this fence ordinance. Now if a drowning did occur because the ladder was left in the pool and the pool was left unattended, then I can see your point.

So now you would need a "fee" for using to much water. Lets put this on the cable bill.

A building permit for a pool- WHAT? If it isn't build right the only bad thing that would happen is it wouldn't hold water. So what.

li713- I got an umbrella rider thing just for this reason. Some dumb parent lets kid out on town. Gets hurt in my yard and now try to sure me BECAUSE YOU DON"T WATCH YOUR DARN KID- whatever!
Reminds me of the guy that broke into home and Dr shoots him and guy then sues Dr for hurting him. Didn't win though. Maybe this was the original plan. Maybe smarter than we think?!

A out of ground pool or one of those cheap rubber ones that holds 500+ gallons of water can hardley be considered a temporary pool. You should have to put a fence up around, and possibly apply for a building permit, as they aren't somehting you can just take down in a matter of min.

Good one TCB!! The comments on here are great. The problem isn't that the city wants to regulate things, it's that there is no consistency to anything they do.
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What property owners really should be concerned about is the liability issue if someone drowns in their temporary pool. The city might fine you for not having a fence, but that's really going to be the least of your problems when the family of the victim tries to take you for all you've got.

Gail price needs to be fired from his JOB. Contact you city alderman and express your disgust with this proposal.

Not only do you have to have a fence for a TEMPORARY pool, you also have to obtain a building permit for a TEMPORARY pool. Do I need to get a building permit for the tent I put up in our backyard for the kids to sleep in some nights during the summer? The fence is a great idea & making it 4' is reasonable since that is the size you can buy at the local lumber store - not the current 5' that you have to special order. The BUILDING PERMIT FEE on the other hand is ridiculous. It's temporary - not a permanent fixture. Contact your council members! I know I am.

The ordinance now requires a fence at least 5 feet tall around pools and hot tubs with sides that are 30 inches or taller. The council will consider lowering the minimum fence height to 4 feet but requiring fences around smaller pools—those with sides 24 inches or taller.

This is just silly- so the pool can be more shallow so now the fence is lower.

So when you build a 4 ft fence for 24 inch of water and they change it back to 5 ft in a couple years you have to rip out the old fence??

See the fence installer adds below.

lilfitz- I agree watch your kid . Had a kid 4 years old out on the town. Told the mom you need to watch your kid and keep him out of my yard when I am not there. I don't have a problem if we are there. She said "am I supposed to watch him all the time" YES idiot!! He is 4. No custody of this kid and one on the way- nice. They were searching for him one night. "he got out" YEP that will happen if you ARE NOT HOME!!!! They were not home when the kid was one the town.

The fence is good just in case your's wonders off for a minute(that can be all it takes) but the kids on the town wandering in your yard is bad. To bad again parent cannot watch their own child.

wonders
Nov 3, 2011 at 5:13 p.m.
I was wondering the same!

carlitosway
Nov 4, 2011 at 12:39 a.m.
Suggest removal

Be grateful they are not asking for a fee on this..."
There is -" putting up a fence fee!"

Frusion- I went to Marshall and the river always scared me. Not even a fence for a school near the river??
They have soem fencing downtown now by the river. Not sure how long it has need there.

"

Seems to me that the city council has more important things to worry about. I am so tired of the gov't thinking that they have to control every aspect of a persons life.

crunch_munch, love the sign--thanks for sharing! The Gazette needs to put a LIKE button by people's posts!

What about a fence around pot holes?

There you go a'gin, Sigma.
Puttin' on a-ers.

It's Gale Price who is doing the attacking. Just like he always has.

Adding a fence around a pool is to protect the homeowner from liability. It's no different than a child getting bit by your dog in the yard,falling out of your tree, etc... Thats one of the reasons you carry homeowners ins. They could have saved the trouble and just changed the existing ordinace. When I constructed my privacy fence (worth it's weight in gold), I got a pamphlet on the regulations-where it was stated that all perminant pools required fencing. The problem is that people buy those cheap rubber pools that range in size from 5' to 30' across. These are much differnt than a little kiddie pool where the water can be easily drained in a matter of secs. They should have just rewrote the ordinance to read that any pool with standing water overnight could be considered a permenant pool. Just because it hasn't happened yet, the chances are that it will. As both a parent and a homeowner, it would break my heart to come home and find one of the neighbor children floating dead in my pool, and have to explain to the parents that were no safety precautions because it was a "temporary" pool, or worse try to pass the blame on them for poor parenting.

We'll have to get big warning signs on all our doors that say "THIS HOUSE IS EQUIPED WITH A BATH TUB"...enter at own risk.

What's next, an ordinance to place a net around your trees so leaves don't blow into your neighbor's yard?

I rent and there's no way my landlord will put up a taller fence, they don't even know who owns the existing fences! Taller fences will not prevent accidental drowings, if a kid wants in a pool bad enough, they'll find a way to get in. And trying to implement putting a rail around the top of a pool is not going to work either when many people own pools with the inflatable ring on the top.

I think requiring 4 foot fenced yard is enough, most fenced yards meet that requirement already.

If the city wants taller fences, then those voting for it can pay for it out of their personal incomes, not tax payer dollars!! And if they want certain type of pool, they can pay for those pools too! Stop the attempts at dictatorship.

Maybe the city will pass an ordinance requiring home owners, renters, retail business owners---anyone who owns or uses a 5 gallon bucket for any purpose to erect a fence around said bucket(s) to prevent children from drowning.....many children drown by falling into these buckets. When will these nannies realize that you cannot entirely legislate safety or personal responsibility?

Next-an ordinance locking bathtubs from use for fear of slipping or drowning in ones tub? How about mandating that anyone with a bath tub or hot tub berequired to install a locking tub cover-indoor or o it door? Criminalizing bath tubs as they are too dangerous!

I know I'm repeating what has already been said below, but we citizens need to demand fences around Rock River, Kiwanis Pond, the infamous retention pond at Walmart, the stream that goes through Palmer Park, etc, etc... Those bodies of water have much more linear footage of exposure to unattended kids than all the pools combined in Janesville.

You can can blame poor parenting all you want. You can say that the parents need to be more responsible too. The fact is that there will always be parents that give their kids too long of a leash at too young of an age. Unfortunately, putting the ownership on the parents is not fair to the kids of irresponsible parents.

Adding a fence should be common sense for anyone that owns a pool. Just because a kid grows up in a house that lacks structure doesn't mean that they should be put at risk because a pool owner doesn't want to install a common sense safety measure in their yard.

...of course the neighbor kid might drown in your bath tub or sink, so better make an ordinance that makes it illegal to let people come over to your house.

Maybe they should just pass an ordinance that you can't leave your house, seeing as how dangerous the world is and all.

So, we have to enclose the pools but parents don't have to watch their kids?

If a kid has the ability to wander off and drown, it also has the ability to wander into the yard of a sex offender, dart into traffic, or climb into a hot car. It will create a false sense of security. All it takes is an older child or a dog to push a gate open and the fence is meaningless.

A chain is only as strong as its weakest link. The parent should be the #1 anti-drowning device.

Very interesting proposal being the city also just required deeper and larger retention ponds for business' that just happen to be right along a new bike bike trail & a couple of blocks from a park. Specifically speaking of the Pine Tree Plaza area in and around Wal Mart & Mercy.

We had a 30" blue pool up this summer in our fenced in yard. We still got a letter from the city saying we were in violation for not getting a permit before we "constructed" our pool. REALLY?
When we contacted the city they stated that they got a list of about 30 addresses from someone that apparently just drove around looking for people to annoy. It's just hilarious that you see all these pools the same size as ours with no fences, but yet we get a letter. This city is ridiculous.

Somebody on the council has a brother-in-law in the fence business....

'If one child is saved it is a Great Law...' ?? I guess we should apply that logic to driving and ban all automobiles.

These people have nothing to do but sit and invent new laws. Pretty soon air will be taxed and you'll need permits to urinate.
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How about we quit letting idiots breed? Then they wont have a hybrid idiot kid that we need 1000 laws to keep it alive.

Be grateful they are not asking for a fee on this...And I see the walking dictionary researcher found another defining point to share. Maybe this person should work for the Government and enlighten them with the legal knowledge and maybe some of this stuff could be put into laws through out the State.

Yes, exFIB that was directed at people who display poor parenting skills, not economically disadvantaged parents, you can calm down. USaret, I am a male. Males can also be concerened about the well being of those who are dependant on adults to make sure there are no death traps sitting around to take them.

Yes, Rusty Rotor, I spelled legal wrong. I didn't proofread it did I? I wanted it to post on top of the post below it. I saw it too late after I clicked post it. Gosh you sure are smart.

But I want you to know that I am in awe of how smart you are to see that and point that out. You don't have much else to offer do you? I would bet that you do almost all of the cypherin at your house, right Jethro?

Typical. There is a pool safety proposal that could save the life of a child. But wait, Janesville residents still find a beef with it. I am willing to bet that many of you also watch Judge Judy and bitch at the TV if you disagree with the verdict.

ha ha...birdbath fence permit, $40 please.....

They made me not only put a fence around mine, but also charged me for a pool permit for my blue pool. The funny thing is, when they inspected mine, they did nothing when my neighbor's pool was in plain sight with nothing around it. Go figure!

Yeh, next we'll be putting fences around the birdbaths and watering pails!

shopiere are you a lawyer? " As an earlier poster posted, the attractive nuisance is the leagal term."
LEAGAL?????????????????
Or did you mean legal. This "attractive Nuisance Doctrine" is just lawyer babble that now has force in the courts.

as much as I hate to agree with anything the city council does, I think a pool protected by a fence is a good idea. We have never had a stray kid in our yard, we do have a privacy fence around our whole lot, and we take no chances with our pool. I would feel real bad if there were an accident. The gate to the fence is most important.

#1 cause of death in America...Heart disease: 616,067

#5 cause of death in America...Accidents (unintentional injuries): 123,706

In 2004, there were 3,308 unintentional drownings in the United States, an average of nine people per day.(CDC 2006)
U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention

Number of children killed by guns per year...Under 200

You all think it is ok to leave pools UN-supervised and without the need of a fence but Scream that blood is gonna run in the streets and we are gonna turn into the Okay Corral because Wisconsin now has concealed Carry, the same law that exists in 48 other states in the country (Illinois being the only one with CCW now). Hypocrites.

Let's see... how many accidental pool drownings were there on private (homeowner) property? How many has there been at Lion's Beach with no fence around it? How many have there been at public pools? It's just another way to get money for the city... you know, pay for a fence to be put in, pay for the fence inspection, now you have a fence so we're going to tax that... "Oh you can't afford a tax increase, the cost of a fence inspection, and the cost of the fence itself? That's ok. There's community pools that aren't open half the time and there's more money that the city can make off of you when you go to the jam packed Rockport pool and can't even move around in the water or have to deal with obnoxious kids when you just want to relax in the evening hours with your own family." This whole city is getting way out of hand!

Would it not also be reasonable to enclose all bodies of water including the river in fencing?

ExFIB: I do believe she meant parents with poor parenting skills not poor parents in the context you think she meant.

With all of these pools currently violating the ordinances, how many accidental drownings did Janesville experience last year as a result of the lack of fencing??

Shoipere wrote......"There are poor parents around who allow their little ones to wander off. "
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So only poor people can be bad parents? Isn't that a little elitist? I'm so glad we have people like you to protect those poor, uneducated people from themselves (sic).
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And since you're so concerned about protecting those poor little runaway children from their un-attentive parents, should we install speed bumps in every road? or how about locking the lids to every trash can and dumpster? Putting child proof latches on every clothes dryer in the city?
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Stupid laws like this just create more stupid laws.

i was referring to Price's statement about the current ordinance about above ground pools and locking ladders. Yes i am completely for pool safety but if put a 4 foot fence up and leave the ladder in the pool you have only eliminated hal the problem.

Why in hell would he want to climb the wall of the pool when there is a nice little ladder stairway attached to the pool? You know, the one that the little one sees all of the other kids use.

This law is not to protect kids from pools so much as it is to protect kids from stupid people who leave a hellishly dangerous thing like a swimming pool with virtually unlimited acess.

There are poor parents around who allow their little ones to wander off. As an earlier poster posted, the attractive nuisance is the leagal term. The law is intended to prevent the lawsuit after a tragedy by preventing the tragedyf.

If a child can climb the side of a 4 foot pool wouldn't the also be able to climb a 4 foot fence?

Once again Gale is in the middle of yet another supposed problem....hmmm wonder where the problem realy is?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attractive_...

When will it be time to eliminate the Sunday drive for fear of accidents?

Simple solution put up fence or take down pool. If one child is saved it is a Great Law....

More money to cost tax payers! Thanks Janesville

Fear must run our lives.

" but how does a 1 year old climb over a 4 foot tall pool wall."

He might not. Just a wild guess, but he might use the little ladder stairway that is shown in the picture attached to the pool like he saw the other kids use. And he might not be 1, he might be 2 or 3 or 4.

If a parent or parents allow a child that cannot swim anywhere near a pool unattended they need to be jailed. I can't tell you how many times a week I see a toddler or small child outside unattended in this city.

Yes drowning is the number one cause for kids that age, but how does a 1 year old climb over a 4 foot tall pool wall. If they can do that they can sure climb a fence. I wonder what the statistics are for above ground pools and accidental drowning.

It sounds like a good idea.

Drowning is the leading cause of accidental injury-related death among children ages 1 to Among children ages 1 to 4 years, most drownings occur in residential swimming pools.Four-sided fencing that isolates the pool from the house and the yard has shown to decrease the number of drowning injuries anywhere from 50 to 90 percent.

http://www.edgarsnyder.com/swimming-pool...

I am sure they will enforce this law as well as they do the parking and littering laws in this city. (Psst. they don't enforce those laws either)

Didn't the city TAKE DOWN the fence at Lions Beach? Hmmmmmm......

Big brother knows best.

...are they planning on fencing in the river next?

How about you leave the parents to parent their children instead of making everyone get fences?