oh come on Joker - check your history books. Janesville was here before GM and - guess what - its still here after GM.

If anything is going to sink this town is this gloom & doom attitude. Yes, this area has taken a major hit, but other parts of the country have it far worse than we do - look at Michigan, Ohio, Indiana or parts of California. As far as comparing Janesville to Flint, get real. The entire state of Michigan is dependent on the auto industry, which is why the entire state of Michigan is in deep trouble right now. Everything in Wisconsin doesn't revolve around the auto industry - I know it's a shock - some people seem to think everything revolves around Janesville.

ndburdick~ I hear ya on the Flint thing, but, I wouldn't count out Janesville just yet. Sure, the auto industry is a thing of the past, but, the future is bright, trust me on that!

If GM workers would have saved money from their HUGE paychecks they would be better off, but no 8or9 credit cards maxed out the latest in new cars then no worry for awhile .

I think the future of Janesville is pretty certain. Take one look at Flint Michigan.

TheJoker- The future of Janesville is uncertain? Spare us all.

fattigman, you make some great points. We have way too many people who like to bring their infinite "knowledge" to the table in times like this. However, it's not knowledge that's going to get us out of this mess. It's going to take something called "wisdom" to get that done. Great wisdom learned becomes knowledge. Without that wisdom, knowledge take us nowhere. I agree with you wholeheartedly about the economy though. We're in a global economy and the internet is at everyone's finger tips! The key to wealth today is being in 100 places at the same time... Until the internet, it was virtually impossible, not anymore!

I've live near GM towns that struggled after shut downs who had much more to offer than Janesville. That was during a better economy also. I'm not a fan of tossing away ten years of my life while Janesville figures things out. By the looks of things it could take ten years or more, especially if sidewalks, bike tunnels, and hockey rinks continue to be the focus of our local attention. Once my wife and I are done school, we'll certainly explore all of our options. It's likely those options will be elsewhere. There is NOTHING in Janesville you can't easily find somewhere else, which will prove troublesome for local officials to overcome.

Oh no, here come the GM Bashers. This should be interesting as once again people go way off topic and start flaming each other. Face it, GM built Janesville and made it what it is. Now that GM is gone, the future of Janesville is uncertain.

Macdaddy - That's why Evansville has grown the way it has also. Janesville could do the same.

i 100% completely agree fattigman!
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My wife drives to Madison and talks to her co-workers and they are amazed at what we pay to own a house here compared to what it costs up near Madison and the drive from one side of Madison or from just outside of Madison is almost as long as it is from Janesville, because of the traffic.
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I have said this for awhile. Who cares if Janesville is a bedroom-community to Madison? At least after they are done working they will be spending their Madison-earned dollars (which is more than Janesville-earned dollars) here in town at grocery stores, restaurants, housing, ect. I do not see one downside to this. And in fact, it could help many of those that are in the building industry get a started on projects again.

People will leave IF they can find a job somewhere else. The unfortunate thing is not many jobs are out there anywhere right now. We moved just short of a year ago. As much as people hate to admit how much an influence GM was on Janesville it did help Janesville become what it is. Any other midsize city in Wisconsin has nothing. Janesville did offer more than most and being between Chicago and Madison off of I-90 is another draw. Janesville may not have much of a night life but it does offer variety in restaurants and shopping. Go north of Madison and Milwaukee and it's like your out in the middle of nowhere. Janesville offered everything a person needed and then some. I did not grow up in Janesville but lived most of my adult life there. Like someone else said it's hard to leave and I hated to leave.

Janesville will survive. It has before just like many other towns have done the same.

Couchsit: Hear hear! I am a professional from outside the area as well. Many outsiders who bring a wealth of technical knowledge and cultural diversity to Janesville come originally from blue collar families. I know my father did not want me to have to work my body as hard as he did. We have great appreciation for the working man and woman, but those jobs simply don't exist anymore. It's time Janesville start marketing itself as a perfect housing option for professionals commuting to Madison, Rockford, etc. You will be shocked at how quickly this community turns around if it opens up to this demographic.

"Macdaddy, even an unusually long recession and recovery is still counted in months, not the years of capital repayment for the projects in question. Life doesn't just stop because some people are out of work for a while."

Life doesn't stop, but the fleecing of taxpayers for pet projects that we cannot afford absolutely should stop and it's about time that the rest of us who get bled dry of our hard earned money stand up to the folks like you who just roll over and go along with every feel good spending plan. Enough, you want a new roof on the Tallman house, YOU pay for it, I've had enough. Tell you what, when I can afford to put a new roof on MY OWN house, maybe I'll think about forking over more of my money for that roof. Don't hold you're breath waiting for me though. It's folks like you that have gotten us the last 6 years of Diamond Jim Doyle and helped put this state right in the crapper.

I'm not sure how writing about people possibly leaving Janesville is pandering. Pandering implies GM or it's employees will benefit from the story. I'm not sure how they would. Besdides, there doesn't seem to be much evidence that "mass numbers of people" are leaving Janesville...yet.

One would think that age would be a simple category. One is either old enough, or too old, right? Unfortunately, it doesn't quite work that way. By federal law (10 U.S.C., 505), the minimum age for enlistment in the United States Military is 17 (with parental consent) and the maximum age is 35 (Note: Congress changed this to age 42 in 2006). However, DOD policy allows the individual services to specify the maximum age of enlistment based upon their own unique requirements. The individual services have set the following maximum ages for non-prior service enlistment:

Active Army - 42
Army Reserves (Including National Guard) - 42
Active Air Force - 27
Air Force Reserve (inlcuding National Guard) - 34
Active Navy - 34
Naval Reserves - 39
Active Marines - 28
Marine Corps Reserve - 29
Active Duty Coast Guard - Age 27. Note: up to age 32 for those selected to attend A-school directly upon enlistment (this is mostly for prior service).
Coast Guard Reserves - Age 39.

However, prior service enlistees can receive an "age waiver." In most cases, the amount of age that can be waived depends upon the amount of time the individual previously spent in the military. For example, let's say that an individual has four years of credible military service in the Marine Corps and wants to join the Air Force. The Air Force could waive the individual's maximum enlistment age to age 31 (Maximum age of 27 for the Air Force, plus four years credible service in the Marines). For the Marine Corps, the maximum age of enlistment for prior service is 32, after computing the prior-service age adjustment.

For the Army National Guard, the maximum age for non-prior service enlistment is age 39. For the Air National Guard, it's 34. For prior service, the maximum age is 59, as long as the member is able to complete 20 years of creditable service for retirement by age 60.

Everyday I read from people on this complaining how GM workers are getting a raw deal or poor them poor me attitude....what about the other hard working people out there who have been laid off and DON'T get a subpay plus unemployment plus if they decide to go back to school, it is all paid for by GM. My husband is in a union, not autoworkers, but another one and he doesn't get subpay, just his small unemployment check. Very hard to live off that. So all you GM workers, stop complaining, you will probably get some huge buyout and at least can live for awhile off that....or maybe not.

JUSTSAY, your brutal!

why because this is where i have lived for 45 years of my life i don't like change i don't want to take my children out of familiar territory and i was one of them holding out hope stupid i know but i was

Dude you are right on the age the last I knew it was 35.

DUDE, love you support for our country, and thank you (along with all of the other military families), but this really isn't the answer for EVERYONE. A person such as myself would have a really hard time in the military with my anxiety issues. I would be forever running to the military medics with paranoia that someone is trying to shoot me....lol. I do believe that a person who is just starting out, and is having a hard time finding a job should consider this choice, but it really isn't for everyone. Just as a nursing position isn't or a factory worker etc....I as a young girl wanted to go into the guards like you wouldn't believe, but I knew I would never make it. I cry when husband yells at me....could you imagine me being yelled at by a drill Sargent? Oh boy, that would be a hoot for the other cadets wouldn't it??? LOL (too sensitive here)

OH I do know what all stand for COLA = living allowance, BAH = housing allowance, Bas = covers food.

My brother works at Lake Orion the last I heard from him they were going to be off for 9 weeks other than that I haven't heard anyting.

We do but it isn't alot. It doesn't cover everything.

Does anyone know the fate of the Lake Orion (Michigan)plant?

tom1- ok if your husband is in the military than how come you dont get COLA, BAH, or BAS?

Yeah I know the benefits I am living them right now.

dudefromjsvl: Great idea but several years too late for me.

tom1cass2 - is your husband in the gaurd or active duty, cause i as well am in the military so you should know the benefits. and you can enlist upto 42 years old, and for the rest of you, yeah the military is looking for people and there are so many waivers now a days anyone can get in, check it out, basic isnt hard, so why not do it?

dudefromjanesville I don't know where you get your info but my husband is in the military I don't get money for groceries and you don't get free housing - you get subsidized for some of it not much at that. They only way you get free housing is if you live on base. And you can not be any older than 34 or 35 to join.

dudefromjsvl that would be a great idea only thing is do you think the armed forces are ready for a group of 40 50 or 60ish year olds to come through their doors. First we would have to pass the physicals then we would have to make it through boot camp how many of us do you think would be left? Not everyone that is laid off is in their 20's.

dudefromjnsvl, you make it sound like the us armed services are open to hire any one. You are sadly wrong. Any health issues are dis qualifiers. At middle age it's not the perfect answer either.

GM closing only added to the problem. They are not the problem. The economy is. Freedom Plastics had nothing to do with GM. Alliant Tech had nothing to do with GM. Gilman had nothing to do with GM.

Prounion - you are not serious are you? People like you are the reason Unions have a bad rap with both employees and employers.

Everyone keeps complaining about no jobs, no benefits, blah blah blah. There are 5 GREAT employers looking for employees like crazy, where you get great pay, great benefits, great everything. Heres the suprize......U.S. Army, U.S. Navy, U.S. Air Force, U.S. Marines, U.S. Coast Gaurd. Why dont you join the service and get all the great benefits. Oh yeah, it to hard for ya'll. Hey the jobs are out there, just do it. Or move out of janesville and go somewhere else and live pay check to pay check maybe scooting by, or join the service and get free housing, you get a steady paycheck, you get money just go to grocery shopping. check it out.

do not give

biggirl - Madison hospitals are laying off nurses. To have ample jobs in healthcare, you must first have EMPLOYED people who can utilize the health care. Not all healthcare is emergency (life & death) type of medicine. I would assume that people are being more leary of seeking medical care when they don't have any way to pay for it. Postpone that knee/hip operation and endure a little more pain.

The domino effect...and they keep falling. Trico credit union (reportedly) will be announcing that they are closing soon and transferring accounts to PCCU. They lost Gilman, SSI, Alliant Tech....

CHELL, got an extra seat?? lol.

I don't blame a single soul that feels they need to move on. I wish each and every one of you success and luck.

If there is a place not affected by the economy please let me know where that is. I would most certainly love to go where the grass is definately greener.

It WILL get worse. Like was mentioned in an earlier post, GM'ers are getting TRA/TAA (I've been through this program), and will be getting Unemployment Ins., pay for travel (not for blackhawk), and books, etc. Sadly, I moved TO this area. Am planning on getting out by the end of summer.

As much as Janesville is worried about losing all its good paying blue collar jobs, I think it should also worry about keeping the white collar workers here. I am a young professional that moved here from outside the area. I want to like Janesville, but I have to say that there isn't much here to attract young professionals and make them STAY. Please don't tell say "if you don't like it, leave" because that is very short sighted. Sorry to say it but, "white collar" people usually make decisions on where to companies locate. This city has come a long way from 5 years ago when I moved here, but a night out on the town will show that this city lacks a certain "refinement" for lack of a better term.

Vanish, not so much. Economically depressed for good chunk of time to come, most likely.

I`m with you Mr. Keith, some are not optimistic, they are in DENIAL. Folks this area might not jump back, wouldnt be the first community in history to vanish. Might want to run while you can..

I like the train idea that somebody mentioned. I could see commuting by train to and from a good-paying job in Chicago (and napping during the ride). Maybe Amtrak would start serving Janesville again if there was enough demand. http://www.trainweb.org/usarail/janesvil... Anyone know if the train tracks also go north toward Madison?

may-be a few less people won't make a difference but lately it seems i can't open the paper with out reading that more companies are laying off in and around our area and it doesn't stop with auto related jobs. It's a domino effect that janesville and surrounding areas will be feeling for awhile. And while we may get some new jobs in the area it won't even come close to making up for all the lost jobs.

Janesville will do just fine - a few less people won't make any difference. New companys will come to town - hopefull "green" ones so we can make-up for all the gas guzzlers we put on the roads.

By-the-by, Janesvillean, your posts are usually well written, level-headed, and appear to be posted after thoughtful reflection. And now comes the odious "But." But you write, "Life doesn't just stop because some people are out of work for a while."
My dear comment-thread writing colleague, are you sure just "some" people are out of work? And, I suspect you are old enough to remember other bad economies where many people's lives and capital projects were indeed virtually ground to a halt. ...'74; '81; 91; and currently, just to name a few. Optimism is usually more useful than doom and gloom, but my god, there is a dangerous economic reality here in this area that many of us must live every day.
Bob Keith
cooldadiomedia.com

make that a possible 85 families and 137 children

...Left in '74 because the Janesville economy sucked. ...Left again in '81 because the Janesville economy sucked. ...Left again in '92 because the Janesville economy sucked and one could find a job in Madison, quit it at 10:00 a.m., and have another job by noon.
This time it is a particularly agregiously bad Janesville economy.
I keep coming back here because, home is home. I love the region. I can't really leave now, I am too old. But, if pushed too far, all options must be explored.
I will not live in a card board box just to accommodate some local culture mistique and local leaders that live in fantasy (let's build 17 miles of sidewalks) - while the region really is descending into economic hell. There is a point where ritualistic fondness for a region is just plain unwise and dangerous to one's health and being.
I see little but seven dollar an hour part-time jobs here for the foreseeable future - if you can find a job at all. This is very simular to the other times I have left here. This seven dollar an hour part-time work culture has been here now a while, long before the local power brokers would admit there was a problem - like as long as four years ago.
We are in trouble, us working schleps are screwed, and if you are not in the Janesville power clique, you are really screwed.
Run if you must, it is just smart to save your families economically and spiritially. I for one, will not begrudge any one for a decision to leave an area regarding survival.
Bob Keith
cooldadiomedia.com

I have filed a grievance with my union and it will ensure a fair settlement for all. We can look forward to cashing back pay like in the good old days.

Getting back on the topic...local workers can't find work. I would think that would be a clue to leave. It should come as no surprise with unemployment rates though the roof. Maybe GM isn't the only one failing in this town as well. The cost of doing business in Wisconsin is barrel few companies choose to take over the falls. The recession will leave an impact for years, even if it ends tomorrow. Perhaps lobbying to state elected leaders is a little too late.

janesvillean: My point is that if you are planning these projects with a tax base of say 60,000 people and then 1/5 move on somewhere else because they cannot find jobs and none are coming here, wouldn't that alarm you? That would mean the rest of us will have to pay more than we are originally told.
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We need to invest in having companies come here and creating jobs. Not stupid "pet projects" at exorbitant costs.

Hate to say it but I told you so. It will become so bad, that we will only need one high school. I agree, we do not need to be adding languages at the school, building a bike tunnel or wasting more money on the ice arena. The new census will show how bad the drop will be.

Aren't healthcare jobs everywhere, including in Wisconsin, generally going to rise (as the population ages)? Most of these jobs do involve retraining, however, because the jobs like nurse's assistant don't pay as much as they should (if we valued our citizens).

a ghost town? no way. GM just wasn't as big a deal as they think they were.

Macdaddy, even an unusually long recession and recovery is still counted in months, not the years of capital repayment for the projects in question. Life doesn't just stop because some people are out of work for a while.

Janesville won't become a ghost town, but I think a lot of politicians need to get their hands dirty and get aggressive with marketing our county. Should Chicago get the Olympics, it will pump money into OUR local economy. We have some of the best landscapes in the Midwest for events!

We could also get the high speed rail-line which will open up corridors to great paying jobs and give us the mode of transportation to get there. Looking to the positive and being involved in your local government can help us get to that point.

Sitting back on our haunches and letting someone else figure it out, won't keep things moving. Get involved with your local government, go to the city council meetings, write our congressmen, aldermen, senators... Take some responsibility for what is happening to you. Make some noise! Get louder! Be proactive... not reactive... Grumbling and complaining about how crappy our local economy is, falls on deaf ears.

Make a difference! If you're unemployed - you have EVERYTHING to gain by getting involved! The politicians already have jobs, paid by OUR taxes! Make them work for that paycheck!

This is the reality check that i wish our local officials would understand before asking for more money to build a children's museum, tallman house repairs, a new ice arena, a parking ramp, a bike tunnel, etc.
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Let's all take a page out of the article and put projects on hold until we see how the entire economic landscape changes and settles down after GM is completely gone and what is left. No need to raise taxes on those of us who have jobs and live here and want to be here.

By now, the smart ones have already left to go find work in areas not as affected by this economy.