justsome1here-I understand what you are saying, great teachers will try their best to work with all students, however when you hve programs like NCLB it becomes incredibly difficult. Teachers are forced to make sure students have information by a certain date for "the big test" so their schools do not look bad. As for business, I am not sure they spend much time training each employee in a way that works best, that is why there are probation periods. You have x amount of time to learn your job and if you do not you are gone.

sparkles and realist - My comments are not naive. I never implied that it would be easy. It fact it would require ingenuity, patience and a willingness to do so. Realist – get real. Of course it is not only up to the teacher, but a bad teacher (one who is NOT willing to take the time) has just as much influence on how a child learns as a good teacher. An outstanding teacher is one that becomes more than just a teacher but becomes a mentor as well.
sparkles – Businesses do not alter their business practices to match how an employee learns, they alter their training methods. Definition of training from BusinessDictionary.com - Organized activity aimed at imparting information and/or instructions to improve the recipient's performance or to help him or her attain a required level of knowledge or skill.

justsomeone,
Sparkles pretty much beat me to the punch here but you totally missed the point of the entire post and picked out one word to try and twist. The point was that students learn more in school than just the curriculum from a text book. Thanks for the quick class on your expertice in teaching though. I will pass that on to my kids teachers if my kid isn't getting an A. Obviously the teacher should change thier ways of teaching because my kid isn't doing as well as I think they can. Screw the rest of the kids who are learning. And no my kid shouldn't have to try any harder because he is behind now. It is the teachers responsiblity to catch him up, preferably on their own time during lunch or something and not after school because I want my kid to be at home watching cartoons with me. Now that to me sounds "naive". But on the other hand, is what I got from your post.

justsome1here-your ideas while good are a bit naive. To think you can alter a teaching method for all 30 students in the class is crazy. My sister is a teacher and she does the best she can to teach all of her students but the district continues to cut teachers making the class size bigger and forcing teachers to teach to the test in the "cookie cutter" way. Besides is school not only a place to learn but also a place to prepare students for post secondary options. I am pretty sure most employeers are not going to alter the way they do business to accommodate the way each employee learns.

realist - Not sure what you are implying when you say "learns" right from wrong. There is no "right" way to learn since every person learns differently. If a child is having difficulty understanding the material being taught as is, then the teaching method should be adapted to the better suit the needs of the child. To say that the child needs to adapt their style of learning to fit the "cookie cutter" mold of teaching is being naive.

Queenb,
Nothing against virtual schools, I honestly think they do have thier place for certain students but as for more opportunities, I don't think so. Personally I think it shelters a student from interaction with other people. Yes they may learn curriculum but are they learning how to deal with other people? School teaches a lot more than book work and state standards believe it or not, some things good and bad, "teacher meltdowns" but how your child adapts and "learns" right from wrong cannot be taught in a virtual school.

Katy,
You don't work in administration for the school district do you? The reason I say that is because it sounds to me like you are trying to sway the "taxpayers" into supporting a pay freeze for the teachers.
Actually I am glad the negotiations aren't being played out in the paper this year. Maybe the teachers will actually accomplish something with this contract whether it costs the taxpayer money or not. Lets look at the money the JSD is really "not" losing this year. I suppose the teachers should take a paycut and donate their insurance savings to the laid off people in town. Because when the same people were'nt laid off the past decade and were making decent raises they were willing to support decent (cost of living) raises for the teachers. Hopefully the tide will finally come in for the teachers to actually get a raise to compensate for the years of economic wealth when they didn't get one. I don't hear anyone complaining about police, firefighters or other state, city employees that have been getting raises. Not saying they don't deserve them by any means, just saying it is kind of a double standard.

Frank, You're right, I looked at the wrong information or article.

http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2007/nov...

Ground breaks, schools shake, taxpayers’ millions go to work
By FRANK SCHULTZ
Thursday, Nov. 8, 2007

The official groundbreaking ceremony for renovations at Craig High School are seen through what was once the cafeteria. Construction, in the form of demolition, has already begun at the school as the eastside's share of the $70 million renovation gears up.

Janesvillee Parker science teacher Sean Hildebrandt address the crowd attending the official groundbreaking ceremony for the school's renovation project. A year ago, voters in the district approved a $70 million referendum for improvements at both city high schools.
------------------------------------------
But Wednesday was the day for the groundbreaking, officials said, because it was one year to the day since voters said yes to the referendum that made the massive projects possible.
.
The vote was 13,040 to 9,973.

sarahb: Yes my daughter has applied in the surrounding area of Milwaukee, but hasn't gotten anything as they all seem to hire within. they have to post the jobs though as a matter of law, but don't have to hire outside if they don't want to. She would rather work in the janesville, milton, edgerton area but has applied even in Brodhead and Monroe as well. She has only one year experience so I guess that's not in her favor. But she loves kids and teaching, JR. High is her heart though! I would think that they would at least interview her but so far hasn't gotten any.

jqpublic: I'm sorry, I wasn't trying to cause you grief. I just wondered if you were really happy as a teacher because most of your postings seem so negative as far as teaching goes. I guess that I was lucky to learn early in life from my parents (maybe also from a teacher or two) that money is not everything or a good reason to select one career over another. By the way since you inquired, I am glad to tell you that I am an RN and now work for a variety of employers ... mostly in the chemical dependency treatment arena. I could probably earn more money if I'd remained in critical care or cardiac stepdown (worked those areas for a total of 10 years) but truly enjoy working in addictions. I've been working with substance users for eight years now. You have a nice day now, jqpublic ... it's beautiful weather outside.

SarahB1: It does not matter what grade I teach or what subject I teach. Why don't you tell me where you work and who you work for? Then I will pick apart some of your ridiculous 700 post!

jqpublic: I've just spent a few minutes scanning some of your comments. Besides your issue with teacher salaries, are you satisfied with being a teacher? What grade/subject do you teach?

jqpublic: I highly doubt that Janesville has 60,000 registered voters. Besides, if the public was against the facility improvements, they would have come out to vote it down.

SarahB1: 4000 out of 60000 people voted to pass the referendum means Janesville supports education. Give me a break!

justsome1here: I am a Janesville tax payer, and as for the Janesville School District, why don't you tell me why everyone is resigning?

jqpublic - You have posted several posts over the past year displaying your disdain and disgust with the taxpayers of Janesville as well as the School District of Janesville. My hope is that you do no let your personal feelings influence you when you are in the classroom and that you remain the professional that you claim you are.

jqpublic: I challenge you to take a tour of the massive additions/remodeling of Janesville's two high schools and then tell us that this city does not value education.

Can anyone tell me how Edgerton can afford to give their teachers a 4.2 percent increase in each year of their two year contract and Janesville is asking for a pay freeze? I will tell you why, because Janesville does NOT value education.

http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2009/may...

According to some teachers I know, examples of working condition issues that COULD be discussed would involve the outside of the work day professional development hours, supervisory duties outside of teaching, prep time issues...while I have no idea if these are the actual ones, these are some examples. Also, a small raise for teachers might not have to involve a tax increase. The "slush fund" has grown by millions over the last decade based on the board taking vacations from paying into the health care fund. Allocating money that is already available in a different way is an option. However, this is an unlikely solution as the board is well aware of the millions of overages over the years yet regularly says they need more money for health care - what they mean is more money for the general fund!

Salary considerations are only one aspect of contract negotiations. Because of the magnitude of cuts being asked for by the state this year, it is the logical place to begin as salary is a high percentage of expenditures. Lay-offs are off the plate in most districts since the deadline for notification is long past. So given this set of constraints, the only alternative to freezing salaries is raising taxes, because the state is reducing its contribution and the stimulus funds are very narrowly targeted to Title I and Special Education. I guess it's up to the negotiations team (union and administration) to get the pulse of the community and decide if they think a big property tax increase could be shouldered by Janesville at this point in time. I'm just making a wild guess here, but my sense is that most Janesville residents would not support a big tax increase.

From the article: "Teachers have emphasized that improvements in working conditions are high on their priority list."
.
MOCO: could you ask your wife, or maybe you already know, what that statement translates to? What working conditions need improving? IMO, if the public was better informed on the reasons behind certain "demands" people might support THEIR teachers and value education a little MORE than ice hockey arenas. Then again, maybe not.

good point on the tax money for hockey vs teachers.

I'm getting a little sick of people wanting things fair and sqaure. Certainly is true that misery loves company. "I'm not getting a raise this year so why should you, you or you?" Like your mom told you: Because, that's why.

and....ilovehockey: you were a little over the top about the ice arena/hockey crap, I agree.

I didnt say you said that, I was asking. Your last post before was a little confusing.

If teachers must take a pay freeze then so should police and fire and all workers paid by taxes.

Improvements in working conditions?

Just be glad you're working.....

You know GM so teachers should not complain about getting paid so little or even just get paid less??

ilovehockey: The economy is not a good reason to take cuts or even pay freezes. This is the most important job in our world with out it there would be no doctors, lawyers, engineers etc.... Yes, there are very important jobs out there but those jobs and really smart people wouldn't exist without a good education. I would agree to cut or freeze wages in most other jobs, private or public sector. The problem with cutting or freezing jobs in this particular field is that you'll begin to lose our great educators for people who are just looking for 3 months off a year. The teachers who give a crap and feel unappreciated will begin to leave. To get us out of this situation we need a well educated society and that starts in our public schools. I certainly don't want a teacher who doesn't care educating my children.

*****************

Why do you (ilovehockey) keep insisting that because you got a freeze everyone should? Life isn't fair and sometimes we need to give a little more to make sure that our building blocks remain strong.

******************

Funny how many people are willing to take on a 38 million dollar tax to keep 1200 jobs but they won't support their teachers. Yes, I know that those jobs brought a lot to the economy but we need to look ahead. We need to have the best education system we possibly can because that will draw future businesses to the area. Great jobs are not given to dropouts, they are given to well educated people. Before you all hate on me, I'm not implying that GMer's or factory workers aren't smart. I'm simply saying that an educated workforces is a better workforce not matter what the field.

Ihavealife -Teachers should be paid a living wage and raises on a regular bases.

Yes, so should you and I, but the reality is that I'm not this year, how about you? I think the teachers constenting to a freeze would show that they support us, the non teachers. As I stated, I agree that teachers do a good job, but so do alot of the others in this town that aren't as fortunate.

No, I don't believe I was "up in arms" over the hockey team. Am I glad its coming, absolutely as I believe it will at the very least help other businesses in this area.

Thanks Sarahb1! :) I didnt mean to sound like I was attacking you I just feel bad for my sister because she LOVES working with kids. Shes applyed at Daycare centers as part time type hours just because she loves kids so much and has never had her own. Maybe if their wadges were not always either getting cut or just never getting raised she could still be a teacher.
And espessially with an ADD child I knwo I couldnt do it everyday. They deserve so much more pay for dealign with todays kids!

facebook09: You are correct, I did not read that your sister worked year-round as a teacher. I thought you were saying that she only worked summers. With that in mind, I thought that there was a possibility that her district paid its summer-only teachers a wage comparable to a "substitute teacher" wage. That is why I suggested she, perhaps, look into another district that might pay more. And, I NEVER did say we should CUT teacher wages. I only stated my opinion that teachers should not expect to be automatically exempted from what is happening in nearly all (if not all) occupations in areas across this nation. Blue-collar, white-collar, full-time, part-time, bachelor's degree-prepared, master's degree-prepared, high school-educated, whatever ... many, many people are facing pay freezes, pay cuts, hour cutbacks, benefit elimination, etc., in today's world. It is just a fact of life in these times. I have always appreciated teachers regardless of what some posting here believe. I can still name every single teacher I have ever had ... and that includes college (associate, bachelor's and master's degrees). My father and one grandmother were teachers; I have three siblings who teach, one in-law, two nieces, and several cousins who teach. I have heard the good and the bad from them re: their careers. In the end, all but one of these relatives is still happy they chose the teaching profession. I chose a different profession and am happy with my choice. My hourly pay is comparable and I am more than satisfied. Even in health care, workers are facing pay freezes, cutbacks, etc. So, good luck to your sister. And, I really do mean that.

Here we go again. Try working in the non-profit sector. Many who work in the non-profit area have advanced degrees and work more hours for less pay and often for little or no benefits.

I didnt say they should get more. I think they should BUT not in todays finacial situation. I just dont think they should get a cut. They teach our kids! They do alot for our kids! They even have to deal with fights and such. So why should they do the same stuff and get paid less?

Here we go again. Why should teachers get a freeze, because I did and I pay their wages! Their job is not more important than mine. Alot of people have important jobs that work to keep our communities functioning, teachers are not the exception. Now, that being said, I do have a school aged child and I very much appreciate the work that teachers do. I just don't think that in times where alot of Janesville citizens are losing jobs and taking pay freezes that the citizens should be required to take even more out of their pockets to give the teachers a raise.

The "hate" canard is sooooo old ......just stop it already...

sarahb: I didn't advocate for a cut, freeze, or increase in teacher pay. I simply pointed out the ridiculous argument that because one believes he/she has had a poor teacher for the child that all teachers should have a pay freeze - actually the poster asked for a pay CUT for all.

sarahb1 do you have school age kids?? Just wondering, most people taht do dont try to bring teachers down. Why dont you go to school and be come a teacher and work for what they make a year.

No I said my sister is a teacher and gets a summer job each year. I figgured you would realize that means she gets a part time job in the summer to fill in the income loss over those months.
She had 25 years of teaching under her belt and hates not workign with kids but she cant have a job she loves and pay the bills so she had to make a choice.
Why would you go from "teahers should get pay uts and job cuts" to "just have them apply other places"?? Fire them from one they can just apply at other places...???

MOC0428: I am far from a teacher-hater believe me. I just happen to believe we are in deeply troubled economic times and that all of us need to take responsibility in doing what we can to help the next person ... I don't think we can afford to be raising salaries at this time. Label me whatever you want, but I have a right to my opinion ... just as you do.

whoanellie: Has your daughter applied in Milwaukee? I know the schools there have lots of problems, but they might have openings.

SarahB1: It's pretty much a given for you to be on here teacher hating. Let's go back to your argument that many others are taking cuts why should they be exempt. Here is the most important reason: They are the foundation of EVERY thing we do or learn in life. They may not show specifics on how to do a particular task but behind all the content is a more important thing that they teach. They show us the way to succeed or the way to learn things on our own.

*************

I would also like to say, as I have said many times before the "what's fair for me should be fair for all". Guess what? Just because I may take a pay cut I don't think everyone else should. That is just ignorance!

****

I guess I would expect more from a nurse. Correct me if I'm wrong but you are an RN right? Where do you think you would be without teachers. I can guarantee that you would not be an RN or even a CN for that matter. Teaching is the ONE profession that society can't afford to skimp on. PERIOD.

My daughter is a teacher, 5 years of college and still can't get a job in WI! She has filled out at least 50 applications. she is licensed 1-8th grade!!! Teachers here do get paid a good salary, they start out at about 33,000 a yr (technically 9 mos.) then it increases all the time. and with the benefits they have it is a good job to have. If there is someone out there who disagrees, give the job to my daughter, she would be grateful!!!

facebooker09: Maybe your sister is earning less because she only works summers ... maybe they only pay "substitute" wages to summer teachers. I don't know the reason. I just know what my relatives earn (roughly).

sarah
I just broke the 40k mark...
With 5 years experience, a double-major and a 1/2 way to a master's degree.
.
The only reason I mention the double-major and 1/2 way to a master's degree is some of those credits count toward advancement on the pay grid.

Yeah well I will tell her taht she just should switch where she teaches...cause tis that easy.

Unfortunately, because teachers organize themselves like meatpackers, no one can tell whether the instruction being provided to the child in question on this thread is great or terrible. Which is just the way they want it.

facebooker09: Then she needs to teach in a different district. I come from a family of educators and the six close relatives who currently teach are each earning close to or more than $40,000 to $60,000 yearly. (The dollar amounts do not include the cost of their benefits either ... and they have excellent benefits.) Their years of experience teaching range from two to more than 25. Two teach in Wisconsin, two in California, one in Illinois and another in Ohio.

Um no not really, my sister was a teacher, not here in town but she gets a summer job every year and last summer she got a part time job at a fast food place here in town and is now a manager full time because she makes more than she did when she was a teacher.

facebooker09: Your statement re: teacher pay vs. pay at Taco Bell takes credibility away from your entire posting.

I hate it when parents say "my kids need ____ )whatever) because of the bad teachers."
Is NEVER the kids right?? All kids are perfect right??
My son has ADD and he didnt need a tutor this summer, and if he did I wouldnt say its because of his teachers because they are great!
Do anyof you know what teachers make?? If they got a pay cut they could go to Taco bell adn make more.

Lost city, it sounds like the reason your child needs to be tutored is because you don't make any sense! Maybe your not involved in your child's education. Maybe your child doesn't listen during instruction!

skinnypuppy: There are plenty of workers across all occupations that are taking pay cuts and/or having hours cut in order to keep their jobs. Many of these are positions that require at least a bachelor's degree and often a master's degree. Why should teachers be automatically exempt from such an event happening?

So because of one poor teacher at MMS, all teachers should have pay cuts? Hmmmm...Seems to me that there is always one poor worker at every company or store I have frequented or had to deal with at some point, so let's have pay cuts for every single worker across the board in every job. Or is it only teachers that should have to economically suffer for the mistakes of a few bad apples? Perhaps if so many students are struggling with a particular teacher or two, the parents should band together and approach administration about the issue. Ask for schedule changes, extra monitoring, etc. I don't think there is evidence that cutting all teacher pay will improve the ability of one teacher to do his/her job.

There needs to be some pay cuts, we have to send our son to a tutor summer so he can learn the things he was suppose to learn during the school year and after with talking to his tutor he is not the only one from Marshall needing help. She went so far as to say that the teacher at Marshall is not a good instructor.

When does Eyster start negotiating for the Board?