The city government will do whatever they want, it really doesn't matter what we say here. Just keep paying your taxes, and hope for a better future.

lovemycounty..Yup it is easy for me to use "emotional catchphrases" just as its easy for you to say "choices need to be made between police, fire, and roads." Do you actually know how big corporations/cities budget? Do you seriously believe that monies for police, fire, and roads come out the same budget as Leisure Services? Sure they are all paid by taxpayers but this is like comparing apples and oranges. Oh well, you believe what you want to believe. It's totally obvious that you have not tried to find something to do in Janesville that does not require tons of bucks for any young people of our fair city that would keep them occupied and out of trouble. At this point I'm so sick all you gloom and doom naysayers. Whatever...its like talking to a wall. You people must be a total joy to be around.NOT.

People just don't seem to understand that if the city kept up on the upkeep of these things it wouldn't be costing as much. If the city didn't let it go for 35 yrs it would not be in the shape it is in and the cost would not be where it is. But they just can't seem to see that.

It's easy to use emotional catchphrases like "invest in the future" and "possibilities for the future." Unfortunately, that's not going pay for the proposed deficit spending to keep an ice rink open. Choices need to be made between police, fire, roads and expensive amenities like ice rinks and children's museums. It's time for the remainder to get over the borrow and spend attitude that got us into this economic mess.

tom1cass2...Hey, I agree totally with you and you know it. Unfortunately, there are WAY..too many uninformed persons who think they know so much about what is happening in regards to the rink and sadly they do not. BUT everyone has a right to an opinion and the naysayers will continue to express anything negative that can be possible about the rink. I don't know about you but I'm tired of beating my head against the wall trying to help those people understand the facts when its so obvious they DON'T WANT TO KNOW OR CARE TO KNOW. I really DO NOT understand where these people are getting their "facts." Supposedly the rink costs $80,000 a year to run. Maybe truthteller is the Janesville City accountant. Who knows? That's the beauty of being totally anonymous in these blogs. You can make up anything you want and unless you are one of those informed individuals that has a clue as to what is going on, no other bloggers know the difference. Save your energy for when we get the new rink and we can help make it a great place to be. I for one am totally for it. I want my tax money to invest in the future. I want Janesville to be known for something other than "Oh that city where GM used to be." Janesville has so many possibilities for the future.

Tom, your right i don't want the city to spend money on anything that is not absolutely needed until we are through this economic crisis.

I take that back it may not be BS but it is not reality to not have the city spend money and take care of their ammenities. I like to have choices of things to do and I am glad my city can give them to me. And if alot of people had their way the city would have no ammenities for us.

While my husband and I enjoy watching our nephew play there, it is not something the City of Janevesille should be sticking money into. Sell it to a private individual or company. If they really see it as a money maker they will buy it. Save the taxpayer money for a change!

truthteller from what I have read you don't want the city to spend any money on anything. And in my opinion that is BS.

csence- your the one that needs a reality check because the ice arena is going to lose millions of tax payer dollars. We already did this once and it has been a failed venture in every aspect! If this was done in the private sector it would have been closed years ago- oh wait a sec that happened too! You guy's say it can bring in $20,000 a year? that won't even pay the power bill! The old ice arena costs us $80,000 a year to mantain(I am sure this number would be way higher if other costs were figured in)The new one will cost much more! plus a few million of our tax dollars to build it! Pure hogwash!

truthteller-time for a reality check. Time to stop living in the past. Ace High and Tanglefoot have been gone for decades and there is a reason for it. If a roller rink would be a good money-maker, Skatin' Place would still be open.

A roller skating rink would be the way to go- costs much less and needs little maintinence. Plus it would be used by ten times as many people and could actually make money. When I was a kid their were three of them in town and they were all busy on the weekends. We would try to go to the one in riverside park and the one on court street where the autozone is now in the same night.

Hannah - For hours for the arena, just go to the City of Janesville Website, click on "Location and Hours" and then click on "Ice Skating Center" and then click on "Ice Skating Center Hours and Fees." All of the information you could possibly want is right there and there is a summer schedule posted and a school year schedule posted. The ice arena doesn't need to have its own website as it is covered on the CITY'S website along with other CITY services and facilities. As for not wanting to skate during free skate. You don't have to be doing anything "fancy," you can go "'round and 'round" if you like.

truthteller - perhaps proponents of the ice arena are more forward-thinking than all of the naysayers on here. They have better things to do than sit at their computers trying to keep up with correcting all the mis-information and ridiculously outlandish thoughts of the many ill-informed bloggers here.

I have been at the rink on many of friday nights where it was full of kids and was very chaotic. The kids were having fun. Since the roller rink is gone the kids are coming to the ice arena, whether you believe it or not. That is a fact.

See thats what I mean you really don't know what you are talking about the ice rink has ran
out of skates on friday nights at times from all the teenagers that come to skate.

hannah you don't seem to even want to try to get it the rink is used for more than just public skate. People have tried to explain but you don't want to see that.

Hannah you go to any rink and that is the way it is, not just ours but all over.

looks like there are only about three real proponents of a new icew arena posting here- you would think if this was so popular there would be hundreds of people in favor of it posting here?

http://www.ci.janesville.wi.us/citysite
/DeptHome.aspx?Dept=IceSkating. Alot less typing.

there you go hanna. a web site for the wounderful rink. took me about 2 seconds to find has almost all the in fo you need.http://www.ci.janesville.wi.us/citysite/service_detail.aspx?Title=Ice%20Skating%20Center%20Hours%20and%20Fees&Dept=IceSkating&CatID_form=402&TopID_form=5

Open hockey is on mondays and thursdays from 6:30-7:30 , 7:40-8:40 depending on your age group cost $7.00. Friday at 8:00am-10:00am also friday nights 10:00-midnight also $7.00.
Summer hockey runs from June 8th thru Aug 27th.
Monday times are 6:30,7:40,8:50. Thursday's are 7:30,8:40 again depends on what level you play at for the times. $125 to join. Kids do come from other citys to play open and the summerleague's

OK Hannah here are the break down of the hours of the Ice Arena (like you would use it anyways)
Mon & Wed 1-3. Fri 5:45-7:45 & 8-10pm. Sat 11:30 - 1:30. Sun it depends on if it is winter of summer for the hrs. Also there is free style ice that you can contract on tues & thur evening & tues & sat mornings. The hours do change every once in a while depending on whether it is summer or winter and on the hockey season. There is also open hockey night which I don't know the hours to that. Alot of the out of town people come for the freestyle ice that is offered. So this rink gets more use
than you want to believe, but then again some of you bloggers think you know it all. Oh by the way freestyle ice is not free you do have to pay for it.

I really don't think you want to go down that road regarding the history of the Janesville rink with me. Suffice it to say..it was privately owned and yes they didn't keep up on improvements, then, the City bought it and yet again did not not keep up on any improvements. So...that why its in the shape its in. The whole point is....that there are many, many people, adults & teen & young kids we enjoy skating. They enjoy Hockey or figure skating, whatever. Many come from Whitewater, Milton, Beloit, Clinton, and all Janesville's other neighboring towns. So, if it needs to be a joint effort between the City and a private owner. Hey whatever it takes. I'm there.

It's very similar to taking your car to the shop after refusing to ignore the ongoing problems you've been having. Once the mechanic gives you the list of things that are wrong and what it's going to cost to fix them, you get furious. You then get mad at the mechanic because your own neglect couldn't possibly be to blame for the high cost of repairs. It's not the mechanics fault or responsibility. It's the owners. And the owners in this case, is the city.

And by the way creatureinthefreezer the rink does get quite a few skaters I have been there
plenty of times when they have ran out of skates and had to turn people away. Have you ever been at the rink to see how many people skate. They are like any other business somedays busy somedays not. But if you don't know all the facts you shouldn't say anything!

MN reference was specific to Midwest. But thanks for the info anyway.

Oh come on spark...you're making too much sense. Stop it. As far as creatureinthefreezer, I REALLY want to know where you get your facts.
Minnesota is the only state that cares about skating? OH REALLY. Yet again uninformed...Stop already. BTW: Colorado Springs, Colorado is the home of the United States Figure Skating Association...but yes Minnesota does have a lot of really nice rinks, I can't argue that. But I seriously doubt they are the only state that cares about hockey, figure skating, and skating in general.

Maxine - You rock!

Let me guess the city decided to just take over the rink for no apparent reason. Nope, The private owner went out of business or so the story goes. Correct me if that is not the case? The city took over the property and since SuperDave already covered what a great job Government does when it tries to run a private business I'll just say see SuperDaves post from today. Since the supporters all feel like I’m trying to take away your right to ice skating and hockey that is very far from the truth. I wish you all could enjoy your sport to the tenth degree. I wish the current place was not falling apart as you all claim. I also hope the city doesn’t continue to put valuable city resources into a venture that by the investors own definition will not make a profit ever. Put the money towards business development so that the tax base is increased so that in time you can have a new ice rink, maybe a zoo and maybe some other improvements. I say make the repairs now, get the place open, look for more investors to put in place the best project for the community. Don’t just push a square peg in a round hole.

creatureinthefreezer - You said "the place has been losing money for decades. So building a new one is going to make up for the wrongs of the past that was not keeping up repairs." Did it ever occur to you the reason it's losing money is because the repairs weren't done when they should have been and it's now cost the facility money? Did it ever occur to you that the reason more people may not use it is because it's a dump because the upkeep hasn't been maintained? That's common sense. I could care less if they build a new one, but the something needs to be done to maintain the current one. The City took it over, they did a poor job with the upkeep and now it's their responsibility. As far as the rink being a success, apparently you weren't around when it was a success before the CITY let it fall apart.

You're so right Spark that is why the rink has been such a success so far. The lines out the door have been so long everyone decided to go home. The place has been losing money for decades. So building a new one is going to make up for the wrongs of the past that was not keeping up repairs. To say people will not move to Janesville because there is no rink. More likely they'll not come to Janesville because there are no jobs. Employers coming or not coming to Janesville has no basis upon an ice rink. More like the tax rate for corporations and logistics pursuant to their business. I would bet your 1 million dollars that Forward Janesville has never had a company turn down moving here because of the lack of or poor shape of the ice rink. If a family is that into Hockey or ice skating sure it would be a consideration but again for this area it falls low on the list of activities for people. MN is a different story. You guys are like shooting fish in a barrel with your arguments. Regarding my comical statement about the size of Janesville and the ice rink. The context was specific to the fact Janesville residents have chosen with their dollars not to spend money at the rink and by doing that made my point. Otherwise it would have been profitable and never taken over by the city to begin with.

creatureinthefreezer - Do you have any idea how many communities the size of Janesville or smaller have Ice arenas? Do some research and you will be amazed. You stating that in cities the size of Madison it only makes sense, is comical.

Now who has the crystal ball, creatureinthefreezer. Good thing you are not on the city council. No offense, but based on your previous comments I think the leaders of this city have a little more foresight of what will benefit this city than you. Hopefully we'll see you down at the Ice Skating Center sometime.

tom1cass2...you know I'll see you there.LOL And Sorry, creatureinthefreezer, no crystal ball. I just know what I know. And stay positive.

Maxine: Getting ahead of yourself with regards to a new rink. Maybe that crystal ball of yours could also tell us if the Packers are going to have a winning season this year? My humble opinion is that the city management will have the following statement in a about a week or so. With careful consideration and investigation into a new ice rink for Janesville the city management believes now is not the time to invest valued resources into this project. The needed repairs to reopen the ice rink in time for league play will begin immediately. The city would like to thank all the concerned citizens for their input and assure the supporters that a project to build a new ice rink will come up for review at such time that our resources can provide for this venture.

Hey Maxine I will join you!!!! :0)

Well..SuperDave..lovemycounty...and stabuck.I guess you told me a thing or 2. Sorry to disappoint you but I'm not part of the "robo team". Maybe their tactics don't work but at least they are trying ARE YOU?. And to the other bloggers who seem to love to disrespect what I have to say...too bad so sad. Yes I got a kid that loves to skate. So what. It's not about me, myself and I. (Although you seem to think it is.) I'M JUST STATING MY OPINION. Like everybody here. Take a look in the mirror and see who you are really talking about. YOUR TAX MONEY...are you the ONLY person in Janesville that pays taxes?? I think not. I have talked to at least "87" (the magic number here) people if not more and even though most don't skate or use the facility at all, they support a new rink. Oh and by the way...Beloit's rink is open ONLY DURING HOCKEY SEASON..(And pretty dang cold to try to skate at on the coldest days.)The facility has temporary walls that are put on in the fall and taken off the end of March. The facility is used for other purposes during the summer months. AND to the uninformed....there are 2 rinks in Rockford (Carlson and Riverside), 1 in McFarland, 2 in Madison (not including Kohl Center which is Wisconsin Badger ice), 1 in Verona, and 1 in Oregon and 1 in Sun Prairie. So....bottom line. No rink at all in Janesville means anybody who wants to skate or loves hockey has to leave Janesville and drive to all the other cities who provide this amenity. It really doesn't matter what any of us bloggers say anyway. Whatever happens will happen. This is just another avenue to make yourselves feel superior and disrepect others opinions anyway. I had enough of this. There are really only a few bloggers who actually have a clue about what is really happening anyway. All the rest of the bloggers are just speculating and complaining. And while your all doing that, in about a year or 2, I'll be enjoying the new mold-free, Freon-free, better air quality rink that I can feel proud I had a part in bringing to my home town.

PanamaRed May 1, 2009 at 11:06 a.m - Thank you for making my point but in your own words. "Giving the current facility, for free, to a group of potential investors would have very little impact on the overall financial viability of project" Yes because spending a million dollars for an Ice Rink in a city of 60,000 doesn't make good business sense. Maybe in Madison the story is different but here it’s a dead horse.

creatureinthefreezer: Thanks!
doseman95: "go ahead and take away one point". You made me laugh :O) Short answer, yes. I have discussed this in the past, you could look up my previous comments, but I really want to focus on the ice arena here and now. The city has an opportunity to correct a previous error, one that we are still paying for today. It's time to stop throwing good money after bad!
PanamaRed: You said "SuperDave, The city could assemble a volunteer board to devise ways of maximizing use of the Ice Skating Center to its full potential. This board would be under the direction of the city's Recreational Dept. Problem solved". You are way more optimistic than I am! My bet would be - problem compounded. The politicization would remain, you would still have different groups fighting over different details. The advantage of privatization is that the owner(s) of the business get final say, and that makes sense when it's their money on the line (not ours). And remember, a private business pays taxes! So we replace a burden on the city, with an income stream to the city.

Thats a great idea, JackSprack! It would certainly help reduce both the environmental impact AND utility costs.

So, timetochange, does Janesville "need" a library, bike paths, pools, parks, playgrounds, schools and sports fields. Why not insist they be privatized as well. Each use more in taxes to maintain than they will ever generate in revenue. The cost needed just to purchase and service the equipment to maintain these places is high enough without adding in labor costs. Personally, I don't think many people would want to live in a community where police, fire protection, utility service and street maintenance were the ONLY "publicly funded" services (either whole or in-part) provided by the city. The Ice Skating Center is affordable. That was proven over 30 years ago and the facts have not changed. I believe the rink should (and could) generate more revenue by implementing a focused marketing strategy designed to attract additional patrons (hosting tournaments, leagues, skating clinics, group events, etc). Janesville does "need" to add and preserve a variety of amenities in its effort to uphold the deserved reputation it has of being a great community to visit, live in and raise a family.

Here is your answer creatureinthefreezer. Giving the current facility, for free, to a group of potential investors would have very little impact on the overall financial viability of project. I suspect that if the investors wanted to relocate the Ice Skating Center, the city would offer the required space at a very "reasonable" cost. Secondly, the Ice Skating Center operating costs are already included in the annual budget. Tell me how much you think your taxes will go down if the rink is closed. Instead of telling others to "get a life" perhaps you need a "reality check".

SuperDave, The city could assemble a volunteer board to devise ways of maximizing use of the Ice Skating Center to its full potential. This board would be under the direction of the city's Recreational Dept. Problem solved.

Petition for a city wide vote on this and lets see where the people stand. Allow time for opposing sides to present their views to the public and then VOTE. With the current economic crisis and amount of tax dollars to be used for this, it would be morally and ethically wrong to sign off on this without a vote by the citizens that ultimately must pay for it.

SuperDave- I know this is off topic, but shouldn't the city privatize garbage collection and snowplowing, as these are " politicized" topics also? People are constantly "whining" (go ahead and take away one point) about these topics everytime the gazette posts a story. Where do you draw your line? What should be funded and run by the city vs. what should be privatized?

Hannah there are still quite a few people in Janesville that can afford to go out to a hockey game or do other things. Not everyone in Janesville has lost there job. Don't lump everyone into the same catagory.

creatureinthefeezer I don't see where you are getting it is all about the me me me crowd we are thinking of the city not just of oneself.
So what if some of the bloggers kids like to skate mine does too, but I want this for the city. My opinion is that is will be good for the city.

Superdave if you had your way the whole city would be privatized. Please get in the real world.

SuperDave: May 1, 2009 at 10:03 a.m. - This is the best post of the thread and hits on all the important issues related to the Ice Rink. Too bad the me, me, me crowd will not even consider facts.

Disclaimer: This is not the way I normally would address another person, but I am obviously trying to make a point regarding this particular blogger. I picked her only because she posted so many times - there are others. I apologize to anyone who finds the following offensive.
maxine731: I will use some of your own words since you might recognize and understand your own numerous "whiney" comments. The ice rink is NOT your own PRIVATE BABYSITTER. Obviously if those "lots of kids" come to the rink just to make fun of the "Robo team" and not to enjoy skating, they should go hang out on your street. If you want to pick and choose (not "chose") what services you want to support with your tax money RUN FOR THE CITY COUNCIL OR APPLY FOR THE CITY MANAGER POSITION or shut up.
*end of rant*
People, this person illustrates perfectly why it's not a good idea for the government to try and run an ice arena. This is what I mean when I say it "politicizes" it. Everyone wants to argue over whether it should be funded, by how much, who really uses it, is it worth it, how it should be operated, yada yada, blah blah BLAH. It's not the purpose of government to own, operate or maintain an ice arena. You can cite all the other things you want (parks, pools, bike trails, etc.), but the government ice arena is in the news today (again), and this is the issue we need to focus on today. It really needs to be privatized. Janesville needs viable private businesses (that can be run at a profit) to attract residents, employers, visitors, etc., thereby providing more business, recreation opportunities, prosperity, etc. (real, not illusory such as when publicly funded). It does not need another tax-funded boondoggle.
But as long as the city keeps trying to make this place its own, it will be a political hot potato and continue to drain city coffers for decades to come.

while you folks are at thinking on an ice arena perhaps looking into some wind electric could be a reallity in lowering some electric cost.
I wonder how that would work out for the old facility as well.That would probably be the better rought to go in the long run.
I don't know why i didn't think of that sooner.

I suggest all you supporters of this also call Eric Levitt at 755-3177 and tell him you want
this Ice Rink. I know I will be,

As you all see the supporters will not even address the simple question as to why they are not in favor of having the building donated as Janesville portion of the project. I'll tell you why. It's because the project will die on the vine without Government Funding from cradle to grave. Janesville as a whole doesn't have the mass appeal for a new ice rink. Maybe 30 years ago there were more people using this service but in today's world it's a loser project. Just look at the projected revenue of $20,000 a year. I think you can make more profit running a coin operated laundry. I suggest anyone against this tell a friend or 20 and call the city management with your concern over this outrageous project at 755-3177. Ask for Eric Levitt

Yep, A bandaid it is! And yes, Let others foot the bill if it's going to supposedly draw the masses which I don't think it will. Not the taxpayers during these tough times. Enough is enough.

If fixing and remodeling the Ice Arena is such a good idea, then let individual citizens invest in it and rake in all the mega-profits. Perhaps Holiday Inn Express will kick in a few hundred thousand in anticipation of all the rooms they will rent on game nights. Maybe the Riverside Restaurant will invest in it for all the meals they will sell to visitors going to hockey games here. Maybe Kwik Trip will fork over some dollars in hopes of selling more gas to out-of-town drivers.
.
Let the private sector hockey puck fans commence investing!

$10,000 band aid...what a joke. I didn't stay at a holiday inn last night,but I do have a degree in HVAC/R.

I personally do not want my taxes raised! It's bad enough to keep my head above water in these economic times. The prior city manager and councils probally drained the money out of the ice arena and used it elsewhere when it should of been used there! Now its, "Janesville, We have a problem!"

Ok, let's mothball this baby, and stop considering spending money we don't have. Saving an ice rink sounds nice emotionally, but it's #103 on the list of spending issues the city has in front of it right now.

Where can I donate? I want to be proud of the city I have grown up in and now live in raising my family. There are plenty of reasons to build this new rink. Yes, my kids play hockey, I am proud of it. There are also alot of other kids that spend time at the rink who don't play hockey. Martin Luther King once said, "I don't know what the future holds, but I know who holds it." Wise man, keeping kids off the street and out of trouble is good for our community's future. Study after study shows it. In my opinion, this rink is money well spent and not foolish!!

I could talk to at least 87 who are for this. I could talk to more than 87 who want it, your argument isn't valid. There is still alot of people in Janesville working and who spend money.

I have asked 87 people since yesterday what they have thought about the city building a new ice arena. All but one was totally against it and most were visibly upset that it was even being considered. One retired couple said they were moving if the city goes through with this kind of spending during these times. Also of the 87 asked 42 were collecting unemployment- 17 from GM and 8 from Lear. All I can say is if the city does do this it means they are not representing the people that elected them.

I'll try again for the for the supporters who seem to avoid a simple question. What is wrong with the city just giving the existing property free of charge as their part of the deal. The private investors can cover all other costs and be 100% owners? Spark and the rest you would do well to make your case for the rink by saying why this is such a bad idea.

Cost: $1,000,000
Annual revenue (before expenses): $20,000

Can anybody on the city council add? This project is a loser and this is not the time for the city to be investing in losers (regardless of who in positions of power have children who play hockey). Let's be honest here, a junior league hockey team will draw no more visitors to the city on a given weekend than 8th grade basketball tournaments do. And how many people would honestly leave the city or decide against moving here solely because we may lose an ice rink? Seriously??? Yes, it would be fun to watch quality hockey in Janesville. It would also be fun to start an NFL franchise here, but would the economics support that type of an investment? Janesville is a great place to live with numerous options for recreation (including a free outdoor ice rink) and will continue to be even without a disfunctional indoor ice rink.

hannah,
There are other restaurants that aren't "box restaurants" Your taking your money out of this city and not eating here is a big part of the problem.
+
I wasn't a big supporter of the ice arena before. Mainly because I never went there for anything. But, after reading the arguments for and against this...I'm ALL for it. Give me a sign, I'll march if I have to. Let's get this moving and start pumping some life back into this city...Janesville needs resuscitation, bad. Consider projects like these CPR for our city...What else can we do to draw people here? Please, don't say a bike tunnel :)

"Janesville NEEDS an Ice Skating Center"...Wow! It is this complete disconnect between needs and wants that created the economic state of affairs in the world today. Comparing the ice arena to the bike path and golf courses (and even more ludicrous to bus service and garbage collection) is asanine and the reasons why should not have to be explained.

creatureinthefreezer - Just another one-sided citizen. By the way, my kids don't play hockey and I don't use the rink. Too bad you didn't get anything positive out of the posts that made plenty of sense. Oh well. Skip past what you don't want to hear and keep being negative like the rest. We all pay taxes for things we don't necessarily use. That's life. Get over it.

Spark and Maxine731 you need to get a life. All you're saying is me, me, my kids, my past time. Well hate to break the news to you but you're in the minority for the town. As far as a company deciding not to come to Janesville because of no Ice Rink. That's a good one. More like they won't come to town because of the tax expense or lack of support by the city government. Nothing to do about an Ice Rink. Let the private group have for free the existing property lock stock and barrel. They can build whatever they want at their cost and be done with it. What is wrong with that? Never get an answer to that question!! Reason is the project is a loser and will not be able to make a profit plain and simple. If people like you had their way we would also be building the newest Amusement park on GM property. "Rust Land" Come one come all and see the days of old. Blah, Blah, Blah.

csense - Thanks for clarifying on the Beloit rink. It used to be outdoors where they practiced and played, but that must have changed sometime ago. Wasn't aware of that.

Spark - Beloit's is not an outdoor rink. Maxine731-are you part of the "Robo team?" You are pretty defensive. I had not heard that term before but I would say it is pretty accurate. The number of staff down there on a Friday night skate is ridiculous. We don't need to pay someone to sit at a "naughty table." The staff that was there before this "team" was sufficient, just should have been told to get out of the office and do some checking on the ice, in the stands, and in the warming room and bathrooms. The staff didn't need an overhaul or additions, just needed some reminders of their job duties.

Where are people getting the 1% if thats how many people they think go there they need to get a life. I am a co-worker with a person in the group trying to get this and he tells me they have the land, have the blueprints, and most of the money rightnow but they want the ice arena to be a public place so to do that some money needs to be from the public. Yes i know a lot of people are low on money, but a new rink will save tax money in the long run and this will bring people jobs and money.

Thanks PanamaRed. It can be extremely painful trying to shed some positive light in the town, especially lately.

Those of you that keep throwing out the magic 1% probably use this. Do you know this for a fact or are you basing this on the amount of people that actually bothered to participate in the online poll which proves nothing? Although I'm sure those of you that are against this thought the poll was the greatest thing on Earth. 100% of the people in the World would PROBABLY rather not pay taxes for anything.

Maxine731 and spark are the only bloggers so far whose comments have made ANY sense on this topic. Not because they support keeping the Ice Skating Center but because they UNDERSTAND the BENEFITS derived from having this facility in our community. Many cities are favorably judged by what they have to offer their residents rather than how stingy they are spending tax revenue. Are those who don't want to spend the money naive enough to believe their taxes will go down if the Ice Skating Center closes? Taxes in Janesville are not much more (or less) than comparable cities in Wisconsin whether or not they have an Ice Skating Center. We, as concerned and responsible citizens, should be trying to maintain and increase whenever possible, additional recreational OPPORTUNITIES for Janesville residents instead of restricting or limiting activities. Had city officials put in place scheduled maintenance and equipment replacement procedures at the rink years ago we wouldn't be having these problems today. We need to do what we can to bring MORE people to Janesville because patrons of the Ice Skating Center spend their money at area businesses as well. Remodeled or built from scratch; privatized or public; beer or no beer; Junior A or not, common sense suggests Janesville NEEDS an Ice Skating Center. Lace 'em up and lets go, time's a wastin'! (PS: hannah, you need to get out more.)

Lets not forget to keep encouraging the city to annex more land in the Milton School district!! That way when Janesville does rebound all these doom and gloom folks can complain about Janesville laying off more teachers because of low enrollement, while scratching their heads looking for the reason why!!!!!

Hey spark...I LOVE sarcasm, but it's sad that you had to explain that it was heavy sarcasm, but I truly understand the need. Duh........

doseman - I forgot about those. Thanks for the heads up!

I would not HAVE to ramble if people would not be so close minded and actually understand ALL the facts. It's no wonder countries go to war. Argue all you want about closing the rink and only 1% of the population using the rink, and the great amount of money spent on the old dinasour and all the people out of work. Yadda, yadda, yadda. My kid enjoys skating...Period. You don't. I get it. Complain all you want. If you aren't part of the solution...you're part of the problem. Go ahead pick and chose where you want your tax money spent. You do your thing and I'll do mine. That's call FREEDOM.

spark - don't forget to stop garbage pick up and snow plowing along with those carbon belching buses. I haven't ridden a bus in 25 years therefore they should sold and the money refunded to the tax payers.

Let's shut down the bike path, the golf courses and the pools and parks too. We are all in doom and gloom and the World is coming to an end. Because we lost GM, we will never survive and this town should be put up for sale and taken off the map. We magically need jobs in this town and preferably 5,000 of them. After all, the community of 63,000 all worked at GM. Didn't they? I could swear by 90% of the posts on this website that's what people believe. Let's have one big plot of land with nothing here so we can all pray that somehow it's going to magically attract people to want to build new businesses and bring jobs here. Let's sit at home and complain about the past and do nothing about the future. Let's not take risks. That was some thick sarcasm there.

Shut down the ice rink and give up on this silly junior hockey team for goodness sakes! Let's use a little common sense and keep our eye on the ball here. This community just lost 5,000 jobs and our tax base is dwindling right before our eyes and we're talking about plowing $1,000,000 into an ice rink that can't make ice and is probably an enormous health hazard with leaky freon and poor air quality when less than 1% of the city's population is probably even remotely interested in the place. maxine731, the only solid point I was able to decipher from your rambling posts was that the ice rink did well when it was owned by private investors. The only way this is a win-win for everyone is if the city sells the place to an investor group and washes its hands of the whole deal.

I'd buy it for $1.00...
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Who wanted to buy it?

You know, many years ago the city had offers from private investors to buy the rink, they didn't want to sell. Now they've let it go to hell, and you think someone is going to want to buy it. Not even for $1. Instead, these private investors will come in, build something new, and the old one will sit and rot just like GM. Then, all the tax payers can complain about what an eyesore it is.

I hear ya, papa. It's addicting though. I actually skipped class so that I could argue about the bike tunnel...believe me, I know it's stupid. I can't help it though!!!

Not that this has anything to do with the broken compressor, but in regard to a previous post about the Robo team: None of us wants to admit when our teenagers behavior is undesirable, but unfortunately when some of them aren't the cause of the problem, they are still PART of the problem (my teenager included)~~I have seen how "teen skate" has been functioning since the placement of the so called "Robo team" and it is definately better, now that things are being controlled. A good majority of past employees have for years sat on their duff in the office while the arena (warming room, restrooms, stands) is being trashed and vandalized during teen skate by kids who clearly didn't come to have fun skating. The troublemakers made it almost impossible for other skaters to enjoy themselves safely. Perhaps the kiddie table doesn't work for every situation, but it is trying to send a message. BTW-That former GMer IS running the rink when he is there on a public skate. He cares about the safety of all our kids-the ones there to skate, and the troublemakers alike. Surprisingly, some of us parents need to occasionally take a timeout to the kiddie table.

HELLO if they are unemployed this new rink could put them to work. Wake up people this would give people work and cash.

I read this on my lunch hour and see there must be a lot of people unemployed with nothing to do but fight and complain.

lovemycountry - You mean like roads built to GM? Airports are only good if there's a reason to land. I'm the farthest thing from a big spender.

listen city council. get out of the sports business. it won't make a dime, it will cost the taxpayers a fortune when there is no fortune to be had, you have better things to do, like figure out where the money is coming from for next years road salt.

Some big spenders here like to keep mentioning Madison as "Best place to live" , etc. They are in fact dropping fast, and may be off the top 100 this year. Why? One reason is insanely high property tax rates ! Is that the road you want Janesville to follow ? Spend on amenities and keep raising taxes later ?

maxine731 - the problem is you can't "have it all". You'd think everyone would have learned that with the mess we are in with the last 10 years of borrow and spend. You have to spend on must haves now and increasing the tax revenue base, and spend on nice to haves in times of prosperity. Look up how businesses are attracted to areas..it's tax incentives, roads, airports - all business related. We don't need to attract employees here with an ice rink, we have plenty of unemployed.

Maxine I love your remarks you have said everything so well!
SaraB I can only speak for figure skaters but when the ice is down the figure skaters go anywhere from Madison, Oregon, Rockford and many other places. I would rather spend my money in Janesville but I need to go where the ice is.

SarahB1 - There is no good option. Beloit is an outdoor rink and if the weather is poor, there's no ice. Next closest place is Madison.

lovemycounty...yet again we get mired in the gloom and doom of a desparate economy. Yes...Janesburg is running in the red. Get a clue...ALL cities are running in the red as is the nation. We ain't the exception here. And I already said we need INCENTIVES to get businesses here. But as I also said, PEOPLE make up the workforce and they need something other than work to make life tolerable. As SPARK so aptly stated...there is a reason why Madison is chosen as one of the best cities to live in year after year...there's always something to do BESIDES work. I have a life outside of my job. I work to LIVE not LIVE to work. And before I hear...well at least you got a job, even if I were not employed...I would not want to sit around and worry ALL the time. Gads...I don't know about others but I have truly had enough of "gloom, dispair and agony oh me, deep, dark, depression, excessive misery. If it were'nt for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all. Deep, dark, depression, excessive misery." (from HeeHaw TV show) Would it truly hurt to think positively once in a while instead of focusing ONLY on the bad? Where exactly does the "pursuit of happiness" come in as stated in the U.S. Declaration of Indepence. Not everyone's "pursuit of happiness" is the same and thank the good Lord above for that. Diversity in opinions...bring it on.

starbuck...You bet I'm a taxpayer AND I've seen those little lovelies at their usual antics and YES..I agree that the "time out" table is childish. You got any other bright ideas on how to keep those little angels in line...bring it on. Obviously if those "lots of kids" come to the rink just to make fun of the "Robo team" and not to enjoy skating, they should go hang out on your street. Sounds like truly wonderful bunch of kids. You must be proud. Hey..if you see the mistakes made by "Robo team" maybe you should go out on the ice yourself and see just how fun it is to try to identify which child is causing the problem and which one isn't. It's just soooooo easy to sit/stand in the warming room and watch and make snide comments about how other do their job. I want to come watch you at your job....so I can have fun tool. Be a part of the solution, not the problem.

The ice rink is much like the government's "stimulus" package. A lot of money, relatively speaking, would be spent for some people to "feel good" in the short term. However, in the long term, instead of creating prosperity and wealth for the average citizen by spurring capital investment here, it would be time and resources poorly spent by a city already running in the red.

THANK YOU SPARK...Now I know that Janesville is not doomed....there is intelligent life in the city, although it seems to be a minority.

Hey maxine731, Are YOU not a taxpayer too? Which I'm sure you are, Then YOU along with the rest of us are paying taxes to the CITY who is suppose to be "keeping up" the ice arena! Obviously they haven't been upkeeping! so don't say that a select few of us are complaining. As for the employees, There are good employees there but ever since the "Dad, Mom and daughter team" who play "robo cop" the problems have not gotten better. My kid tells me a lot of kids go there just to get a laugh at the "robo cop" team. And, My kid isn't a perfect angel by any means as I'm sure yours are not either but I have been there on friday night skate and I have watched my kid and have seen what goes on. I'll say this, The "robo" team does make mistakes on who to blame for problems. And this "time out" table business is childish! Before the "robo team" the persons working there were doing a fine job taking care of the problems.

Okay...hannah...let's shut the ice rink down. Oh, wait...it's already shut down because whiney taxpayers didn't want to pay for upkeep for 35 years and the compressor is shot. Good...we'll just send all those angels to your house for something to keep them off my street. Hey...it's your idea not to provide a place for the kids to go, not mine. Since you are so good at providing answers...then come up with a better idea.

And one other thing. Do any of you posters ever read the previous posts before you comment? Some of you ask the same questions that have been answered many time before. Try reading some of the posts and maybe the same questions and comments will stop. Read maxine731's post and you will learn something.

Why do you people think Madison is always voted as one of the best places to live? Why do you think so many people enjoy it there? Because there's so much to do outside of your daily work schedule. Sorry, I know people are out of jobs and times are tough. Aside from that, my life doesn't revolve around work every minute of the day. In order for a city to attract new business, attract people to want to move here, etc, there needs to be something special about the city. Things for people to do. Attractions. GM is gone folks. It's not coming back. The complete auto industry is done for. Janesville is no longer a GM town. This city unfortunately relied on that for too long. If some of you don't start looking at the big picture and realize some risks need to be taken in order to rebuild this town, we will have no town.

I guess I'm confused why it is the city's (our) responsibility to fund an ice rink anyways. This is only used for people who choose to use it. Bowling is also a family pastime. Does the city pay to maintain a bowling alley?
If so many people use the ice rink & it is so needed why haven't they brought in the money over the years to be able to maintain it?
Quit using my money for things like this.

Hey lovemycountry....I agree that we should attract people to Janesville and use some tax money as incentives to get businesses to come to Janesville...Good point. BUT....business employ people, who when they are not working, want to be able to enjoy their free time doing activities. We can attract all the business we can, but if we don't provide some sort of services for their leisure time...those same workers will find activities (spend money) in other cities and live outside of Janesville(tax dollars for another community)because there won't be anything for them to do, short of sitting in front of the idiot tube. Can we please handle one social issue at a time? I agree jobs are VERY important but maybe, just maybe we could also use tax money to enjoy life. Everyday life can be depressing enough just thinking about all the social issues that our tax money can be used for. Can we not spend a little money (I use the term little in the total scheme of the general City budget of millions and millions of dollars) for something we can actually enjoy to take our minds off of the everyday crap? Why is that so hard to understand?

No business is going to be attracted to a town that has and offers nothing outside of work. Sorry.

Hey starbuck.....have you ever STAYED to see what those little darlings are really like at the public skate time? My guess is NO. You can be furious all you want but there are many kids (and yours just might be included) who knock over other kids on the ice while playing tag, throw things on the ice, use foul language, trash up the warming room, and are just otherwise obnoxious. The people who work at the ice rink should be given a lot more credit not condemed. In their job they have to put up with a whole LOT of crap from obnoxious kids as well as parents who mistakenly believe their kids are angels. The ice rink is NOT your own PRIVATE BABYSITTER. However, that is a moot point now as we have NO ice because taxpayers and concerned parents like yourself didn't feel it necessary to pay for upkeep for too many years.

Having an ice rink to "attract" businesses is about 56th on the list of what's important to get jobs here.
Instead of spending $1M on an ice rink, the city should spend it on recruiting businesses and providing incentives for companies with jobs to move to Jville. Giving money to companies as tax incentives is #1, and it's expensive. Use the money there for jobs.

maxine731 - AMEN. GREAT POST THAT SPEAKS THE FACTS!

Gads...I'm simply amazed at how totally uninformed people can sit behind their computer screens and anonymously shoot their mouths off about issues they have little or no knowledge about. If they had any knowledge of the history of the rink, they would know that 35 years ago when it was opened,it was a privately owned rink and did quite well. Some excellent, well known Olympic figure skaters trained there as well as an Olympic speed skater. Those in the younger crowd may not have heard of the Olympic gold medal winner Janet Lynn, but she did not only train in Rockford, but also trained right here in Janesville. In the skating community then Janesville was considered a really nice rink to skate in both with Hockey AND figure skating. Unfortunately, its painfully obvious that after the City bought the rink and made it public, whiney taxpayers didn't want to spend the money to keep it updated. They wanted to spend money on other projects like bike paths, swimming pools, youth/park summer projects, baseball fields etc. NOW....the rink is a mess and you're moaning and complaining about the fact that it needs major work. WOW BIG SURPRISE. SORRY...you can't have it both ways. Try not keeping your car well maintained and see how far you get before you have to start walking. Just because YOU DON'T ICE SKATE does not mean tax money can't help support it. AND by support it, I mean only 20%. I wish these bloggers would bother to get their facts correct before shooting off their mouths. Not everybody rides bikes, or plays in the parks or swims or uses the senior center, or any number of other facilities that the City supports, but tax money still supports those services and by a much bigger percentage, like 80% or more. If you want to pick and chose what services you want to support with your tax money RUN FOR THE CITY COUNCIL OR APPLY FOR THE CITY MANAGER POSITION or shut up. If we have no rink AT ALL, we will have an even bigger exodus from Janesville than we do now as there are more people who use the ice than you think. People who love just skating, Hockey, or figure skating WILL find somewhere else to skate and WILL go spend their money elsewhere and that's not a may-happen scenerio....it is happening right now. Get the facts straight.

Yes, The ice arena has been bled dry and money used for other purposes rather than for the ice arena from what I've heard. And, On another note, The guy in the picture is a former GMer and he thinks he runs the ice arena along with his wife and kid. Isn't that nepotism? Didn't we have that issue once last year??? My kid was reprimanded by his wife for doing nothing wrong at a "time out table" which consisted of a little baby table and 2 chairs! I was furious!

For those of you blaming the city council in this story and other stories related to this topic. I find it ironic that's the route you're taking considering you could blame them for not fixing the problems years back when they should have. It would have been much cheaper then. Now it's a huge problem. Whether you agree with it or not, the ice arena was public back then also so it was the city's responsibility. Instead the money was spent on bike paths, etc. I'm all for the bike paths, but I don't use them. Similar to how many of you don't use the arena. You ignore your car repairs too long, look what happens. Common sense.

We have a whole industry in Janesville to fix broken parts for GM. I bet one of these machine shops would love the work right about now! And when these shops make a custom part they alway's make a few of them because it's setrting up the machine that takes time- running off the parts easy. What part are we exactly in need of?

So, we normally lose $80,000.00 a year on this money pit, and now we need to sink $10,000.00 to replace one broken part, $350,000.00 to bring it up to the standards the bartender wants for junior league hockey games, and to plan on spending $1,000,000.00 on future repairs.
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Sounds like someone from GM management has already secured another job - managing Janesville's finances.

The picture is worth a thousand words. The government ice arena failing, NOW, before our very eyes. Privatize it. Government has no inherent expertise in operating an ice arena. And not only is the profit motive lacking, it tends almost by definition towards politicization.
City residents, look at the picture. Can you see your money out there, melting away, then evaporating into the atmosphere? I sincerely hope you enjoyed the experience, when it's gone, it's gone.

Janesville has crumbling roads, a lack of incentive money to attract jobs, a lack of money to plow snow, and an increasing amount of homeless children - remember this story ?
http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2009/apr...
And there are still selfish, arrogant takers that want to spend $1M+ of our tax money on an ice rink. How sad.

madman1961: Sometimes angry/silly/idea, posts make more sense to me than some of the others. Good job.

Here's an idea...if the hockey league is thinking about building their own rink, let's sell them THIS one for one dollar with the proviso that they have to provide reasonable time for local use and then THEY have to come up with how to get it done without MY tax dollars!

I'll even loan them the dollar...then I'll write it off as a dead loss and we'll all be even.

What a money pit!!!!! Why not just play hockey down at Traxler when the lagoon freezes over and after the game they can walk downtown and go to the bars.

Just wondering. Are Darien and Janesville "sister cities"?

50 years to break even? It would have to be all rebuilt again before then. It's just a big ole money pit.

oh by the way it isn't just a ice hockey rink, it is a rink for more than hockey like figure skating, public skate and community use. I don't know why people think our community don't use it, they do no matter what you beleive.

I don't know where you got the idea that it is just ice hockey people that are supporting this, I'm not hockey and i support it. I know alot of people who support this that don"t play hockey. Your facts couldn't be more wrong.

Please Remember...

The only people that are supporting the ice hockey rink are those that have kids playing in the rink... or friends that they are supporting.. They are supporting there own selfish interests..

Nobody else realy cares...

Gimmee a beer, barkeep. I've got a powerful dry on. burp...

this is a good example of what happens to the spendaholics city council. throw them a bone and drop the big one later. it happened with the library and the city bought it hook, line and tax increase.the kind of tax increase that seems so low and so reasonable but added to all the others has become an ourtage.when will it end????

"$200,000 for improvements...cost would (NOW) be closer to $350,000...future repairs are ESTIMATED at more that $1 MILLION...ESTIMATED the team could bring in UP TO $20,000 a year in revenue."
Next it will be the lack of parking lot space. Who are the "investors" in this team -- I have yet to see any article identify these shady characters, and just whose money are they investing (TAXPAYERS MONEY, by all I can find, not their own!).
Is the council on HEROIN too? DUMP THIS PROJECT NOW (unless all you council members want to foot the bill from donations out of your own pockets!).
STOP SPENDING MONEY YOU DON'T HAVE ON PIPE DREAM PROJECTS!

This ice arena has been nothing but a pain in the ICE,from day one! Has "NEVER" made a dime,even the dumbest business person would tell you that this "IS" a dead horse that needs to be buried.

Well lets see if they spend 1 million and they bring in 20,000 it would only take 50 years to get back the money without any interest added in. Take the responsibility/expense burden out of the hands of the city by giving the property to the investors as our part of the new building/project. This way the city no longer has to pay for any expense for up keep etc. Brings the property back on the right side of the balance sheet and can be taxed as a normal business.