Okay.
Im a student at one of the high schools.
I've seen this before.
The administration will tell the staff that they need to keep a tighter hold on things.
It goes for a while, but then it just goes back to the way it was.
Doing this is not going to stop students from using this language.
Nothing will.
Its all around us, what's to stop us??
There's no incentive for anyone.
Its not like most students say these things so loud that teachers can purposely hear it either.
Think way back to what happened up at Parker last school year with the free speech issue.
Why couldn't the staff and administration have done something then?
I think the teachers are too afraid that their students are going to get THEM in trouble if they take disciplinary action on them.
Who cares, you're the teacher, YOU deserve the respect, don't let anyone take that away from you.

why leave out the elementary schools? It's ridiculous how little respect even the 4th and 5th graders have for teachers, custodians, other parents and other students...basically everyone. Respect is not instilled in children's hearts or minds through daily work anymore. There's no need for a "class", but there is a definite need for stopping disrespect where it exists. I enjoy the "reality show" called "Principal's Office". I think more and more schools need to have policies in place that take away attending prom, make in-school suspension something that is dreaded rather than "cool" and restrict sports and other events when a student can't behave the way society's laws have dictated. We, as a society, MUST stand up to the "free-spirit" and "entitlement" philosophy that kids today are learning. We may not be "teaching" it to the kids, but by not stopping it, we are nodding our heads in approval. I shudder to think what the next generations will look like in terms of employment, financial burden in the form of taxes for the programs for the "needy" who grew up with their hands out, but were not willing to get their hands dirty to give back in return.

villajanesville Sorry to say some but not all kids grow out of profanity. I think that’s why there is the problem now. One of the best parenting skills is teach by example. If you lie, cheat, sell or swear what can you expect from your children?

I think that the math teacher made great points. Teachers can address students in the halls if they hear "bad words", but do you know how long that would take? When I was in HS, we were always respectful in classrooms, we didn't swear towards people just because we wanted to call them a name. It's a form of expression! Students shouldn't be dropping the F bomb every minute either, if they want the respect they think they deserve. I think a bigger problem that needs to be addressed is all the neighbors I have on South Fremont, who have to put up with 10 different groups of kids standing in their front lawns smoking! Pretty sure they aren't 18! But swearing is a problem?

"Name calling" probably can't be controlled in a school hallway, but I hope parents of young children teach that it is not acceptable behavior. I remember many, many days of heading right to my room upon arriving home from school ... it was one place I could cry into my pillow and let the sadness out. Being a victim of endless "name calling" hurts and it drives kids into isolation. It shouldn't just be "kids being kids." Parents need to raise their children up to a higher level. Teach them respect please.

I believe when you put 1800 14-18 year old students in one school you are going to get some inappropriate language. Teachers are going to pick their battles and not always react strongly to a student making a "BS" comment.

Unfortuantely our education fu8neding encourages districts to build huge schools because they are less expensive in the long run. Now we have teachers who have no clues who the majority of students are and trying to confront an angry 16 year old in a crowded hallway when they don't know who you are - it just doesn't work.
I hope teachers continue to pick their battles but if the worst thing going on during passing time at Parker and Craig is an occational F-bomb - we are probably doing alright.

Interesting that the Gazette headline to this article uses the very language that is the target of the effort.

There is ABSOLUTELY no excuse for any child of any age to be using vulgar or bad language. It's bad enough adults use it.

Pack - for a teacher to tell a child its okay only in the bathroom is so ridiculous. Especially one that young.

Name calling has always been and will always be. Name calling is kids being kids. We grow up and grow out of it...(at least I hope so).

My granddaughter (4) spent the night this weekend and informed me that her pj4 teacher told her she could use bad words in the bathroom but no where else. So, I went in on Monday and asked for an explaination. I was told by the teacher that what happened was some kids were using bad language and she told them they had to use those words in the bathroom. *WHAAATTT*????? No teacher, now you can explain to my granddaughter that she can NOT use those words EVER. I understand kids get most of the words either at home or from other kids, but going into the bathroom to use them is not the answer. Better stop them at age 4 than worry about it once they get to high school.

Once again, lets make the school district correct the problems that ineffective, lazy parenting presents. Then those same parents can complain about what a poor job the school district does with their children.

Many people seem to think, and have expressed that schools put up with foul language. As a teacher, it is almost never heard in my class and if it is always addressed. The hallway is a different story.
--
It is not tolerated, IF you can find the person. Walk through Craig High School at passing time, we have 1800 students, and 100+ staff trying to get from place to place.
--
As I clean up my room, head down three hallways to my class getting pushed and bumped by the throng of kids and adults, if I hear a bad word, or see a kid with his cell phone, etc. I address it.
--
Do I have time to stop write an office referal? No, down the hallway I have 25-30 kids I'm expected to be responsible for in 3 to 5 min. I'll take a simple Im sorry and go on my way.
--
Even if the kid ignores me, what do I do? I don't know all 1800 kids at the school. Do I leave my 30 kids in the room unattended for 5 min and give up some of their lesson time for a kid that ignored me. If something happens in that class I'm supposed to be getting to (say a kid trips and breaks his arm) the parents can sue me.
--
I think what happens at most high schools is that if the teacher has time they deal with it in more detail. If the offense is repeated or escalates, then the teacher may stop to deal with it.
--
I will however take whatever time I have to address issues as they arise and will also go into more detail with kids I know. I hope that other teachers will reach the kids they know well.
--
All that being said, it could be re-stressed a little bit; however, the administration at Craig is the best I've ever worked with. They are always in hallway and will back teachers up all the time. I watched
one Asstant Princ. call an AFrican American kid on using the N word. The kid said, "I'm black I can say that." The AP said, "not in my school" and the kid got a week of restricted lunch a punishment that the kids REALLY hate.
--
Last note, I'm typing during the Packer game so if you want to critique my grammar/spelling I get to come to your work and critique your math. *** SMILE ****
--
Jim Reif
Craig HS Math Dept

.........let me back up here a minute and say I possibly could have misunderstood what the teacher had said, however, I have heard others use the excuse that "its no worse than whats on tv", or the other way around.
.
Circular reasoning at it's worst......
.

I know this is off-topic and I apologize, but forget the movies in the classroom. And not because of the language. Let the students watch the films on their own time at home ... they can rent the video or borrow it from the library. Set a date that it needs to be viewed by and then hold the class discussion. Why waste valuable class time?

The article doesn't name the "teacher" that said the language is "no worse that whats heard on tv and movies"....That response has to be the absolute depth of ignorance .... from a "teacher", no less.
.
I wonder how this "teacher" would feel if someone vandalized their house or their car and the vandal used the excuse that the vandalism was "no worse than vandalism seen on tv or in the movies".
.

Badgerlvr, then you should be showing those to your children in your home. It shouldn't be up to the school to show movies rated R to children under age. If a parent wants their children to see them, then by all means. But don't assume all parents want their children to see them. I don't call it censorship...I call it my prerogative as a parent. And my right as a parent.

Some of you are missing the point. This has nothing to do about movies. It is about vulgar language and other bad behavior that takes place in our schools. The movies referred to are still allowed (parental approval needed if rated "R"). The movie angle in this story was simply a teacher pointing out that language used in a R rated movie (shown in an advisory class) was similar to what was heard on a daily basis in the hallway.

The issue here is not about censoring movies, rather it is about censoring certain types of student language and behavior.

Thought you should know.

Bill Sodemann

When my son was in high school, he watched "Schindler's List" and "Mississippi Burning" in history class. Both films contain the words Mr. Sodeman is against. Though I agree with him in principle, these are films of great historic value that students need to see. Anything other is pure censorship. There must be exceptions to his rules.

Schools shouldn't tolerate it but it starts at home. Parents need to start cracking down & taking away privileges until they can talk decent.

While I appreciate the Gazette for giving this issue publicity, I find the front page headline (which was NOT written by Frank Schultz) to be part of the problem. While "hell" is not as bad as many of the words that are being said, I would have hoped that the Gazette would aim to be a more positive example. Instead, my 9 year old sees a picture of her dad in the paper, is drawn to read the article, and is asking why the paper is using this word. I didn't have a good answer for her.

Thanks to those of you who share my concerns.

Bill Sodemann

Thank you Mr. Sodermann! I have been in the work force for thirty plus years. Three of the companies I have worked for are Fortune 500 companies. In two out of the three, every employee has been required to attend sexual harassment training, which later was just called harassment training. This goes back to the early 80's. Using foul language is very much considered a form of harassment if it falls on the ears of someone who is offended. My current employer has a zero tolerance policy and this could be grounds for dismissal. Perhaps the schools need to adopt some type of similar training where each student signs off that they received the training and that they understand what the consequences are. Similar to what parents and students have to do for sports conduct. As far as the punishment goes, perhaps a team of students and parents should write the consequences/punishment. If we are truly training our children for the future this needs to be dealt with immediately. It will not be tolerated when they go to work. Actions speak volumes.

Northman,
I like your idea.
On a different point, I think this language thing starts at home. I see a lot of parents now days swearing at and to their kids. I just heard a mother in the grocery store call her kid a little F'er...I said to her, "Nice!" (being sarcastic) and she seemed like she didn't care...

PARKER HIGH SENIOR YEAR EARLY 90'S WE WATCHED "ONE FLEW OVER THE CUCKOO'S NEST" (1975) AND "RAIN MAN" (1988) BOTH "R" RATED FOR PSYCHOLOGY CLASS. IT IS FUNNY HE DOES NOT MENTION WHAT MOVIE IT ACTUALLY WAS THAT WAS OVERHEARD. THIS WAS EVEN BEFORE HAVING A POLICE LIAISON OFFICERS ON SIGHT...WHAT NEXT AND OUR PARENTS KNEW!!!

"Non-Swearing Knights.
.
"Twenty-five years ago a young railroad employee was standing in the ladies' waiting room of a station in the Middle West, when through the open window came a blast of such profanity and vulgarity from some railroad men outside that he felt ashamed of his companions. He resolved that he would do his best to remove this blot from the reputation of railroad men, and to this end he immediately started, among the men working in the station, the association of 'The Non-Swearing Knights', which has been enlarging
ever since.
.
"The order is unique in having no meetings and no dues. Each member, on enrollment, pays five cents for his card, which contains these words:
.
"'Swearing is a violation of the laws of God, of this State and of good society. And I am therefore plainly neither a Christian, a good citizen nor a gentleman, if I swear.' The pledge of each member is 'to try and abstain from profanity.' This is not made more stringent, because it might bar out those who need it most, and who would be afraid of breaking it unthinkingly if they made it iron-clad from the first. It is said, however, to be remarkably successful in its effects.
.
"The young man who started the order still directs it. Two bishops, a governor and two ex-governors are among the members, and men of every class and profession are on the rolls, which now register ten thousand names."
.
From Martha Tarbell's _Teacher's Guide to International Sunday School Lessons_, 1913.
.
(Craig used to have a placard with the pledge hanging near the front office. It would likely not have withstood a separation of church and state challenge as it was not presented in historical context.)

No idea how to help, really. Maybe having the coaches address the issue with their respective sports teams would be a start? I think a lot of athletes are looked to as leaders, perhaps start with them and see if the new trend takes hold?
+
As far as actual punishments being doled out, I really don't see that happening. Students and some parents alike will be screaming about the infringement on first amendment rights.

I'm not surprised by the language used by students and young adults these days. The music they listen to even has them singing along to the lurics like these are acceptable things to say. I don't have a solution for the problem, but I applaud Mr. Sodemann for addressing it and trying to clean it up.

Use of bad language can become a bad habit. If these kids are talking this way at school, they are probably talking the same way at home, and may have heard it there to begin with. Parents need to step to the plate and crack down outside of school hours too, or the cycle won't be broken. And what about the rest of the community calling people (kids and adults) to task in public? I appreciate Mr. Sodemann's effort on this subject, and look forward to seeing the plan. I only hope it doesn't take the entire semester to implement it.

Northman--you hit it on the head. Who will enforce the new game plan? Like SarahB, I also work with younger people--high school aged and just out of HS--and using profanity in a customer service job doesn't even faze most of them as inappropriate. It's incredible! Tasers for all teachers! If TX teachers can carry guns, why can't WI teachers carry tasers? (sarcasm)

Northman...I know that you're using sarcasm...but I have to say...I giggled a bit. Funny stuff. Anyone remember soap and rulers? Heck..I graduated in 1986 from a farm community school. And we were still seeing some of that. I don't condone it, but I don't recall ever swearing in school (without whispering it). I won't say I was innocent, but I certaining didn't shout it through the halls.

I think Bill should be applauded for his effort to curb this. It is only a start, but it also has to continue at home.

It’s a wonderful initiative, but the enforcement will be a bugger. I imagine the kids using the bad language will just laugh it off when a teacher calls them to task.
.
How about giving each teacher a taser to enforce language and discipline problems? You might want a de-tuned model, with a bit less voltage than the police would want to use on a meth addict. After little Johnnie gets fried a couple of times, he’ll quickly learn to watch his language. I’d bet most teachers would be happy to pay for the tasers with their own money, just for the immediate positive change they would bring.

I agree with Mr. Sodemann on this issue. I have recently held jobs where most of my fellow employees are many, many years younger than me. They are great fun to work with, but their use of profanity in front of clients is shocking! I can only imagine what it is like in school. It's also shocking to read how long it takes to install a plan to crack down on the culprits in school. I guess the days of just a general announcement over the intercom system are long gone.

Some think that it is amusing to read the opinions of public school detractors with poor English and spelling skills. I wonder where the amused think that those poorly educated posters acquired those skills.
Part of the problem with course language in school may be the teaching philosophy embraced by public schools. Their emphasis on reinforcing self-esteem coupled with a reluctance to stifle creativity is a prescription for this kind of behavior. How can we be surprised by the inappropriate behavior of halls full of naturally competitive and poorly disciplined children with inflated egos and unbridled imaginations?

And it always cracks me up when comments are geared towards other posters' misspellings and grammar. Are you here to be a spell checker or share your ideas related to the article? I, for one, am looking forward to hearing more about the "game plan" that the area principals have devised to help clean up this situation. Can anyone argue that this type of action is not necessary?

Amen, Hockey!!

It always cracks me up when those who are critical of the school district prove in their comments that they obviously failed English and spelling classes.

Many teachers say things to students talking inappropriately; I have seen it many times when I am in the schools. However, I also believe that with proper backing from administration more teachers would be willing to take a stronger stance. It all starts from the top down!

If we want children to stop using bad language at school, or to prevent it from happening in the first place, we need to consider where they learn to talk like that in the first place. Parents cannot let their children watch South Park, those crap reality TV shows, or anything on MTV and expect their kids will not repeat what they hear. I was just watching Wife Swap yesterday and heard B***h being used--that show is on in the evening, when children watch TV. Parents need to be responsible for monitoring how and when children are being exposed to the horrible language and material that is all over TV and the internet. That alone won't stop the swearing and disrespect in school, but it's a start. Also, what about those parents who talk like that in front of their children, or those who let their children swear at them? It shouldn't come down to teachers having to monitor the language of their students--that's not what they signed up to do when they became a teacher, but that is part of a parent's job.

So how will you stop this if the teacher's are in class or just don't want to get involved with the kid that has a bad mouth, Remember these kids know a day will just tell you to go get {F} If it is in the class room then the teacher should kick them out,If you mandate a teacher to monitore the hallway's then it will cost everyone money for that teacher to be there, it is a no win situation, unless MR.Sodemann wants to monitore all the hallway's for the school district for free.

The language is horrendous at basketball games and other events where parents are around. I can't imagine how much worse it is during school hours. The thing that really surprises me is a lot of the worst offenders are the girls.